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#420290 - 02/15/13 09:05 PM Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee
papa lou Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: 04/23/06
Posts: 889
Loc: Los Angeles, California
I was born at 6:00 pm at night but not last night.

Has anyone dealing with Chase been told "Chase said that the buyer pays the full negotiator fee only?" Typically I have seen a 50/50 split. I told her I want to see in writing that Chase said the buyer pays the full negotiation fee.

Despite a direct question - Is the negotiator paid a flat fee of percentage? If a flat fee what is it?

She answers "yes". Yes what? She is avoiding telling me how much fee is? Who is the negotiator? I told her I want full disclosure before I agree to amaterial term of the contract.


Has anyone else had similar experiences with Chase? Or is this just the listing agent tryign to find some inexperienced newbie and have them pay teh entire amount so she does not have to pay her 50% share?

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#420295 - 02/15/13 09:32 PM Re: Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee [Re: papa lou]
Scintillion Offline
Member

Registered: 01/26/12
Posts: 437
Loc: Colorado, USA
Have not had any experience - but heard that Chase was one of the best banks for getting Short Sales done.

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#420379 - 02/18/13 11:30 AM Re: Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee [Re: papa lou]
sacbroker Offline
Member

Registered: 10/31/07
Posts: 330
Loc: Sacramento
papa, it is illegal in CA for a buyer to pay "short sale negotiation fees" The reason being is that negotiation is the agent's job. We just had two Brokers of MAJOR kw offices lose their licenses over that.

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#420385 - 02/18/13 01:47 PM Re: Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee [Re: papa lou]
papa lou Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: 04/23/06
Posts: 889
Loc: Los Angeles, California
so I guess when Chase finds uut that listing agent were strong arming the into pay a 1% negotiation fee; they will deny it. I just wamt the property to flip it.

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#420386 - 02/18/13 01:58 PM Re: Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee [Re: papa lou]
Vermont Offline
Major Contributor

Registered: 04/12/08
Posts: 7717
Loc: Vermont's North-East Kingdom
My experience is that a 3rd Party Negotiator is usually paid outside and well in advance of any Closing, and represents the Seller in trying to get the Mortgagee or Lien Holder to settle with the Mortgagor for the lowest possible sales price and without the threat of a deficiency judgment.

My thought is that they are usually paid a Flat Fee for their Short Sale Consultation and Negotiations between the Seller and the Lender; AND they collect that Fee regardless of whether the Seller succeeds in completing a Short Sale or not.

Most of those that I've encountered seem to be more along the line of scam artists who claim they can help desperate sellers who are underwater . . . . but still have a few liquid funds that these guys want to get . . . . and most of them are not licensed.

I know one guy who is also a Loan Modification Specialist. If he can't get you money to do a Short Sale, he'll go for collecting a Fee to help you get a Loan Mod . . . . in either case, he wants payment up front.

For all I know, he'll also intervene on your behalf with the IRS; but you pay upfront.
_________________________
Dale C. Hittle of GOLDEN RULE PROPERTIES in Glover, Vermont
Where We're Always Striving To Put Together "THE FAIR DEAL"

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#420473 - 02/19/13 05:36 PM Re: Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee [Re: papa lou]
DueDiligence Offline
Major Contributor

Registered: 12/05/06
Posts: 1635
Loc: Wild Wild West
Originally Posted By: papa lou
I was born at 6:00 pm at night but not last night.

Has anyone dealing with Chase been told "Chase said that the buyer pays the full negotiator fee only?" Typically I have seen a 50/50 split. I told her I want to see in writing that Chase said the buyer pays the full negotiation fee.

Despite a direct question - Is the negotiator paid a flat fee of percentage? If a flat fee what is it?

She answers "yes". Yes what? She is avoiding telling me how much fee is? Who is the negotiator? I told her I want full disclosure before I agree to amaterial term of the contract.


Has anyone else had similar experiences with Chase? Or is this just the listing agent tryign to find some inexperienced newbie and have them pay teh entire amount so she does not have to pay her 50% share?



Who is this "she"? The seller's agent? If so, was the "fact" that the buyer will pay for the seller's negotiator disclosed?

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#420751 - 02/26/13 06:35 AM Re: Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee [Re: DueDiligence]
RecoveringREAgnt Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: 03/26/08
Posts: 998
Loc: Los Angelesl
PapaLou: Read CA Civil Code 580d & 580e, plus SB1737...you will get all your answers there.

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#420779 - 02/26/13 04:38 PM Re: Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee [Re: RecoveringREAgnt]
CALIF DREAMING Offline
Veteran Member

Registered: 08/01/06
Posts: 1304
Loc: Downey, California
The way this was explained to me at a seminar was that any short sale negotiator must not only be licensed by California DRE, but is paid for by whomever hires the negotiator, and because it is for the sellers' benefit to relieve them of their mortgage, then it is a sellers' cost, just like the sales commisison is.

We were told that neither the buyer nor the selling agent is required to pay for this fee.
_________________________
"People rarely succeed unless they have fun in what they are doing"....Dale Carnegie

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#420959 - 03/01/13 04:21 PM Re: Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee [Re: sacbroker]
Jeff Adams Offline
Member

Registered: 12/08/05
Posts: 385
Loc: Monterey CA
Originally Posted By: sacbroker
papa, it is illegal in CA for a buyer to pay "short sale negotiation fees" The reason being is that negotiation is the agent's job. We just had two Brokers of MAJOR kw offices lose their licenses over that.


I believe this to be incorrect information. It's very possible they lost their licenses for not correctly disclosing the fees, but it's not illegal for a buyer to pay the fee. Please look up "DRE Winter 2011 bulletin" and refer to page 3. Acting California Real Estate Commissioner Barbara Bixby wrote:

A persistent question that the DRE
receives on the subject of short sales is whether
fees can be charged to a buyer in a transaction to
compensate a short sale negotiator, or to provide
additional compensation to a broker, for the work
necessary to accomplish a short sale. California
Senate Bill 458 (2011), which was signed by
Governor Brown and became effective in July
2011, prohibits short sale lenders from requiring
the seller(s) to pay any additional compensation
- aside from the proceeds of the sale- in exchange
for the written consent to the sale.


The Real Estate Law does not expressly prohibit the payment
of short sale negotiator fees by a buyer as long as the
purported short sale negotiator is properly licensed under
California law, and there is an understanding by and full
written disclosure to all parties in the transaction, including the short sale and originating lenders.


To ensure that there is no confusion, mystery, or lack of
transparency with respect to such fees, the compensation
should be disclosed to all parties in writing, both in the
purchase agreements and in the escrow instructions, and the
fees must be properly documented in the appropriate line
item(s) in the HUD 1 closing statement.

So if you read what the Commissioner wrote regarding the law, it's clear that sellers cannot pay negotiator fees, but buyers can (assuming that it is properly disclosed to ALL parties in the transaction).

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#421069 - 03/04/13 10:24 AM Re: Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee [Re: papa lou]
realtorWayneBroo Offline
Member

Registered: 01/22/13
Posts: 10
Loc: West Palm Beach, Fl
First, I don't work in Ca. But, the quoted law in the above post does not prevent the Seller, or the Buyer, from paying a negotiation fee. The law says the Lender can't demand any extra money from the seller. The seller can agree to pay a realtor/3rd party, from what I read.
Chase won't pay the negotiation fee, and doesn't dictate who pays it, even thpough if the seller has extra money, they may feel entitled to it.

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#421080 - 03/04/13 12:18 PM Re: Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee [Re: realtorWayneBroo]
Jeff Adams Offline
Member

Registered: 12/08/05
Posts: 385
Loc: Monterey CA
Originally Posted By: realtorWayneBroo
First, I don't work in Ca. But, the quoted law in the above post does not prevent the Seller, or the Buyer, from paying a negotiation fee. The law says the Lender can't demand any extra money from the seller. The seller can agree to pay a realtor/3rd party, from what I read.
Chase won't pay the negotiation fee, and doesn't dictate who pays it, even thpough if the seller has extra money, they may feel entitled to it.


Your interpretation is correct. The seller could elect to pay the negotiation fee, but it cannot be required of them. On the other hand, the seller can also direct that the buyer is to pay that fee in the seller's listing agreement. If the fee is disclosed properly in the MLS, stated on a purchase contract addendum and correctly disclosed on the HUD-1 statement, then it is "legal" (assuming the negotiator is a licensed broker or attorney in the state and the fee is for actual services rendered.)

There is a lot of misinformation on this topic among Realtors in California. Lots of brokers are telling their agents that it's "illegal" for buyers to have to pay short sale negotiation fees. The information is on the internet that the fees are clearly not illegal if handled properly.

If agents or brokers are concerned about it, they can always offer to pay the fee out of their commissions at close of escrow. In my area, most listing agents force that on selling agents anyway.

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#421125 - 03/04/13 10:42 PM Re: Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee [Re: papa lou]
Crispin Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/04/13
Posts: 1
Loc: Uk
Nice information..Thanks for ones marvelous post!

http://utahloanhelp.com/stop-foreclosure


Edited by Crispin (03/04/13 10:42 PM)

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#427138 - 08/14/13 05:56 AM Re: Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee [Re: Jeff Adams]
The Rosch Offline
Member

Registered: 11/12/09
Posts: 119
Loc: St George Utah
Originally Posted By: Jeff Adams
Originally Posted By: sacbroker
papa, it is illegal in CA for a buyer to pay "short sale negotiation fees" The reason being is that negotiation is the agent's job. We just had two Brokers of MAJOR kw offices lose their licenses over that.


I believe this to be incorrect information. It's very possible they lost their licenses for not correctly disclosing the fees, but it's not illegal for a buyer to pay the fee. Please look up "DRE Winter 2011 bulletin" and refer to page 3. Acting California Real Estate Commissioner Barbara Bixby wrote:

A persistent question that the DRE
receives on the subject of short sales is whether
fees can be charged to a buyer in a transaction to
compensate a short sale negotiator, or to provide
additional compensation to a broker, for the work
necessary to accomplish a short sale. California
Senate Bill 458 (2011), which was signed by
Governor Brown and became effective in July
2011, prohibits short sale lenders from requiring
the seller(s) to pay any additional compensation
- aside from the proceeds of the sale- in exchange
for the written consent to the sale.


The Real Estate Law does not expressly prohibit the payment
of short sale negotiator fees by a buyer as long as the
purported short sale negotiator is properly licensed under
California law, and there is an understanding by and full
written disclosure to all parties in the transaction, including the short sale and originating lenders.


To ensure that there is no confusion, mystery, or lack of
transparency with respect to such fees, the compensation
should be disclosed to all parties in writing, both in the
purchase agreements and in the escrow instructions, and the
fees must be properly documented in the appropriate line
item(s) in the HUD 1 closing statement.

So if you read what the Commissioner wrote regarding the law, it's clear that sellers cannot pay negotiator fees, but buyers can (assuming that it is properly disclosed to ALL parties in the transaction).




That is the way I understood it when reading it just now. Looks like an open market!! lol.
_________________________
"Buy low sell high" Isnt that the only way we do it!

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#427250 - 08/17/13 04:38 AM Re: Chase is short sale bank - negotiator's fee [Re: papa lou]
HomeTeamGA Offline
Member

Registered: 07/14/11
Posts: 339
Loc: Georgia
Are you talking about the commission or a fee paid to a 3rd party negotiator? First of all in a short sale all of the commissions and fees are paid by the primary mortgage holder of the property. They determine which ones and how much they pay. That number is determined by the short sale negotiator for the lender. If the short sale falls under HAFA guidelines then there lender is required to pay a full 6% commission, otherwise you are at the mercy of the lender. 3rd party fees may or may not be paid depending on the lenders guidelines and practices. Many 3rd party negotiators are also the same attorneys who will close the loan. If they can't get the bank to approve their fee then they just settle for the closing fees and leave it at that. Under no terms are they allowed to pass those fees on to the seller. I imagine a buyer may agree to pay them but I would never advise a buyer to do so.

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