Anyone have a rough idea on what the cost is to remove a bank vault from a 3,000 sf community bank in a shopping center. I was just wanted to get a rough idea before I talk to the LL about exploring non-banking prospects to lease the space.

Why not market it to other banks??

We have many of those around here. It is cheaper say for Chase bank to reface an existing failed bank then to buy land and construct new. Most banks want to purchase the building and not lease at least in GA. For instance Chase is inline in a strip center but landlord is trying to up the sq ft on their lease renewal so they are looking to purchase a failed bank location and reface.

I just think the cheapest route is to market it to another bank whether for lease or for sale.

Your local state department of banking and finance has a list of current banks with monthly deposits that you can market the location to.

It's the angle I would take first....

Super, c'mon, you should know me by now! I've already been working the bank angle hardcore. Unfortunately, I haven't received the interest I thought I would...so I am starting to think of a plan B. If a bank doesn't take the space, the LL would prefer to lease the space as is with the vault in place...which can have some appeal to some local retailers (restaurants, etc.). However, as I'm sure you know, bank vaults don't exactly fit into the prototypes of most national retailers.

Here's the good & not-so-good of the site/space:

The Good...
- Incomes: $94.5K Avg HH Inc (3 mi)
- Population Density: 65,355 (3 mi)
- Traffic Counts: 26,500 ADT in front of center
- Co-Tenancy: Big box national anchor & national coffee chain in outparcel
- Ingress/Egress: At signalized intersection allowing right/left in & out
- Signage: Large/prominant position on main pylon sign

The Not-So-Good:
- The center is perpendicular to the road with the anchor closest to the road and the small store in-line spaces on the far side of the anchor
- The available bank space is the end-cap...which is space furthest away from the road
- This is an older center located away from main section of shopping centers in the market - half mile away from "main & main."
- There's only one drive-thru window...most banks in the market want a minimum of two.
- Most banks in the market want a free-standing building

So back to my original question...do you think it's cost prohibitive to remove the vault and v-box the space?

So basically this is an old shopping center in a B location.

The bank is located at the end of a strip and they left a big vault in there when they left.

Yes banks definitely want free standing for sure.I don't know your area but basically good shopping centers that are older are losing out to new builds. In my area older centers say 10 to 15 years old with anchors are having a hard time leasing up. The reason is before a tenant would be paying maybe 18 to 20 sq ft and the new builds in hot market were at 28 sq ft. Now new builds are at 20 to 22 sq ft and the old centers are not wanting to budge on sq ft so tenant is leaving to UPGRADE for close to the same sq ft they are paying now.

That is what is happening in my area and they are getting FREE TI as well.So the landlord in these older centers with a lot of competition will have to sweeten the pot to get any action.Has the landlord refaced the outside of the shopping center to make it look new again?

Sometimes the landlords won't do this as they have had a reduction in value and would rather hand the keys over to the bank than outlay more capital into a sinking ship.

I would think the vault would take up a lot of useable space. Usually dry cleaners want the endcaps. Is there one already in the center ? Could you lure one away from another location?

I used to own a restaurant and I wouldn't want a big vault in there. It would take up to much space I would want for back of house and upfront seating plus you would have to get the health department to approve it.

I am sure if you rent it for cheap enough someone will express interest to go in. What is the vacancy rate of the center currently?

Yes, it's an older center in a B location in the market. Vacancy rate is +/- 2.6%....this is the only vacant space in the center.

Also, LL has space priced correctly...asking rent is only $17/sf nnn which is priced well enough below the class A centers. NNNs are very cheap relative to the market at $1.83/sf...they are usually $4-5/sf in our market.

I mentioned restaurants as an example as a possible user as in my market restaurants using the vault for seating has become somewhat of a popular thing to do.

Unfortunately, there's already a dry cleaners there. Also the other usual suspects...pizza, chinese, and nail salon.

97 percent for a B location is awesome and we are not seeing that in my area.

We have a new power center in Cherokee Ga on the main highway. Kohl's,Lowe's,Dick's sporting goods,Books a Million,Target,and Best Buys.

It's about a 1 million sq ft development and has all the usual restaurants Olive Garden,IHOP,etc. This development still hasn't been able to lease up fully and is owned by Sembler. In my area B locations are about 80 to 85 percent and A's at 90.If the anchor goes out it is a killer for the center as the tenants want a huge rental reduction or they invoke their anchor co-tenant clause and break the lease and move. I don't blame them as if the traffic is gone then you can't pay those high per sq ft rates anymore.


What about one of those postal UPS stores or mail express where they have copying,etc.? The safety deposit boxes are already there with the vault. They could play on extra security for you valuables etc. I don't know just thinking outside the box.

Jewelry store would be another good one as they could put everything up at night into the vault.

It's a toughie for sure. Let me know how it turns out.

Just a thought based on another use I saw once.

There is a former bank in Jax Beach that is used as a pharmacy. The vault is used for storage and as a place where they can lock up certain medications when closed.

Lease it to a Gun Shop, Coin Dealer, Pawn Store, Jewelery Store, Sports cards shop, A "We Buy GOLD" store, Check cashing/Payday loans store.
These are all the possibilities I can come up with.

Guys, Thanks for your input...I actually have all the retail categories covered.

Also, most of the categories mentioned are either prohibited uses (gun shop), an excluded use (pharmacy located inside anchor), not a desired use (pawn shops, check cashing/pay day loans, etc.), or the retailer prototype is too small (UPS Store maxes out around 1,800 sf...but prefers smaller). Also, the "We Buy Gold" guys in our market are in smaller spaces...1200-1400 sf. LL has no desire to divide the space as will leave two spaces with 15' of frontage.

Jewelry is a good concept but not too many mom & pops doing deals in the market right now.

Is the landlord trying to get 17 sq ft for all spaces. Meaning if the other spaces are renting for 17 sq ft but closer to the anchor he might need to lower his per sq ft price.

Maybe a steakhouse restaurant with a cowboy theme. The vault could have pictures of outlaws and their history etc.Maybe landlord helps with TI and reduced per sq ft rent plus gets a percentage of sales until restaurant gets off the ground after year 1.

While I don't deal with commercial real estate I was a project manager for a large construction company and have personally worked on about a dozen new construction banks. Typically they fly the precast concrete vault into place before the trusses go on and weld it to plates poured in the slab. If the building is concrete block some banks will use an exterior wall as the side of the vault. They are 18" thick concrete with triple mats of #5 rebar at 5" spacing each direction. The mats are offset from each other for maximum strength.

They are not built to be removed and could not fit out the door of the bank once the roof trusses are on. It would need to be broken. Taking a jack hammer to one would be a lesson in futility. You'd need to cut the slabs into pieces with a diamond blade wet saw. Only problem is you'd need at least a 48" diameter blade and a machine big enough to turn it. If it's anything like the vaults we built, it's not coming out. Best you could do is have the door and any safe deposit boxes removed to free up space.

Thanks Ben - That definitely answers it! I appreciate the info...

It crazy because you never know who is looking for a bank vault. When I was working in the music industry in New York City I went to a recording session at a $5M studio and the studio was inside the a bank vault. I asked the owner why put your studio in a vault his answer was "because it's cool". In another town close to me there is a Night club/strip club called The Vault, when you go inside the first thing you see is this massive vault with a round steel door like you see in the movies. Inside the Vault is the main stripper area stage, bar, lap dance area and DJ booth. My point is that it doesn't have to be marketed to banks only. You could market it with some crazy idea like these. If it's taking long to sell or lease then this might be a great approach to take. That is if your up to it.

Years ago we had a big building that was imploded. It used to be a major Department store in Dayton. One day they closed a few streets and sidewalks for an hour and there was a series of explosions (Whos idea to do this on a Friday at 4pm??)

It was reported though the small explosions were done to the vault. My guess is that vault was removed in pieces and can't be cheap. I worked across the street from the building and it shook the ground.

and now for the rest of the story or should i say answer not an eazy task removed one back 2 years ago palo alto shopping center in california took us 7 12 hr working days 6 men at night had to keep noise levels down during the day wet saws yes 48" hand held jack hammers blow torches bob cat with hammer atachments and lots of manual labor negative air machines for dust control air blowers for fresh air on and on the valt also had asbestos on florring so all and all the vault went for about $34,000.00 and the profit margin was tight so theres your answer