I have been lurking this forum and wondered why we are not helping eachother with reasonings for all of the guidelines we have to deal with on all of our BPOs (seems to be a major part of reo business), and maybe form a solution to our problems. I have seen lots of REO posts, and this is not for that ! I appreciate all the help an REO agent can give in a BPO impasse, but I would like to remind everyone posting on this thread that this is for educational pourpose only and is intended to help all of us that have BPO comp issues, qc issues, or any other BPO issues that may arise with any of our bpos, markets or extrordinary circumstances that are requested of us to evaluate

Please share all that you can in regards to your difficult bpo assignments, including as many details as you possibly can, so that we can get the picture of the subject, your area and the subjects market.

(this is intended to help us all bpoers and our bpo results with the most stringent issues we are confrunting with, the new guideliness, the requests for higher values, location withtin a 0.5 mile radius (when we know its not possible but we are not allowed the comment space because the bpo form is constructed with minimum comment space and we are trying to fit the condition in there), age (that doesn't seem to matter anymore in certain markets), amenities or superior attributes (the bpo companies want us to forget about), etc.)

Thanks from a bpoer


And this is my story: I have a 2198 sqft brick house, built in 1981, it's a 3 bedroom, 2.5 baths, with a 2 car garage, on a 1 acre lot.

Based on my research there are no sales in the subject's area similar in size, age and lot size within the past 12 months, and if I am to use what they say (within 1 mile and within 6 months), I am going to really hurt the client, whomever the client may be ... I don't know. Because if I am going to consider all of those homes within the 0.5 miles or even the 1 mile from subject, I am not going to be able to find comps traded in the same market as the subject. And they don't get it. And I get the QC person on the line, and then their supervisor, and maybe I can get through to them at that point. But it seems to me like most BPO/CMA/AVM companies are geared to be consistent throughout the country, and that is just not possible.

Every market is defferent. Subjects are different, and they all have their own market in the area. So when we are talking about markets, we are actually looking at multitudes of markets, depending on area, location, subject characteristics and amenities, past, preseent, future time ... whatever. There is no way these bpo mills can tell us that the subjects market should be based on a generic format, and restrict us to a 0.5, 1 or 3 mile radius and not allow us to submit the finished product unless we adjust or change our comps which may be equal to the subject, but not based on the BPO company guidelines because it may be 10 miles away. LOL

What are they going to do when they are going to get a HOTEL bpo or mom & pop's motel that's nexxt to a highway ?! Are they going to expect us to use the same guidelines as a residential ? Don't even think any of these mill bpo companies have any commercial bpo forms. I already know they don't have any vacant land bpo forms LOL

Any imput is appreciated !! As long as we can all learn from it

This is an ivite to all bpoers that have comp, qc or any issues with their bpos or their forms requiremets - not related to technical issues regarding bpos ... this is all related to value :P / pricing :))

Quote:"What are they going to do when they are going to get a HOTEL bpo or mom & pop's motel that's nexxt to a highway ?! Are they going to expect us to use the same guidelines as a residential ? Don't even think any of these mill bpo companies have any commercial bpo forms. I already know they don't have any vacant land bpo forms LOL"

Sometimes it's like talking to a wall. The part about the motel really got my attention.

Three different mills sent us the same order last week. Pulled up old MLS and it's a 7000 sf being used as a Bed & Breakfast with an attached conference center.

Explained to all that it could not be comped - That there probably weren't 10 properties within 50 miles this big. Two of them understood right away. The third (with assignment and QC on another continent) kept calling and calling. I finally asked if they knew what a B&B was and of course they didn't. I asked to be transferred to someone in the states and they refused. Then they called back and wanted it done as a commercial property and "How much do you charge?" They couldn't seem to get over the no comps available part.

And all these calls of course were gratis, since we never even accepted the orders.

I had this restaurant establishment as an reo assigned to me by Ocwen for the past 2 years and kept telling them its commercial and I don't do that !! And the hindu rep kept pressuring me that I am responsible for the asset and that I have to rekey and do my bpo and I said "No I'm not. I don't do commercial" and made sure to include his supervisor and the REO AM & his supervisor.

Probably that why I am not getting any more Ocwen assignments

LOL

They had this assigned to my Broker about 4-5 years ago. We almost had this sold if they would've just demolish the front pavement that was agains city code and paid the liens or negotiated them down.

Now ... they just sit with it vacant and unattended, wih tons of liens and title issues ...

Ocwen sometimes doesn't want to listen.

PA: my office used to manage all of the VAs in my county before they were outsourced to Ocwen. We've done lots of REO work in our office for the past 15-20 years, so we really knew what we were talking about ... but I guess Ocwen felt compelled to treat us like any other office ... LOL

Any agent in my office could take an REO from assignment to closing ... anytime

And we're only 7 agents left from the old crew. Hard times ... not as many properties to handle, lots of competition, and a broker that wants to retire soon and is not interested in being the preferred broker for HUD, VA or whatever anymore

I've never worked for Ocwen and explained why in another thread a few days ago. I just have some problems with their business practices and really have never wanted to be associated with them.

I was at a conference a few years ago where the head of their REO department (Non VA) got up to the podium and ranted on and on about what a poor job agents did and he'd fire anyone immediately who didn't meet their time lines, etc. Kind of remided me of the way they treat their employees.

I have lots of remarks on how Ocwen conducts their business and I have done work for them since I've started in this business.

For example I can see my reviews on my Ocwen bpos. I have done them for over 4 years and I obviously know their platform through and through.

So for my own listings, I always read their reviews and reconciliations to my bpos / cmas. And majority are done by a hindu representative, that has no idea of my market, nor has an idea of what my subjects market consists of. Andd they rely on a trulia.com of some sort website to determine if I am correct or not.

I have seend this in a lot of other bpo platform qc models. Not my problem, but ... that lender is probably going to get a zillow.com reconciliated value for as much as I care. It is not my lending decision to make

And all of this bit them in their rear and it will affect their lendin decisions or asset dispossal for years from now.

I got the opportunity to see 2nd and 3rd opinions on my reos and I mentioned all the flaws to my AM.

Issues that come up on our bpos versus the 2nd and 3rd opinions are not something we always get the chance to see. Every time I get the opportunity I will do a review on the 2nd opinion or whatever and make sure I catch evry thing that hindures my marketing.

BUT ... getting back to what this post id meant to do ... help with any comp, qc or bpo issues, that many of us could help with, if we are given the right information.

There are too many guidelines that make no sense. There are too many qc requests that make no sense. And for the most lucky of us, there are reviwes or reconciliations for our own assets bpos that make no sense.

This thread is intended to attempt in helping us that need it. New or seasoned at this bpo craft all those appraisers are so envious about

LOL

Sometimes you run into a situation like that doing bpo's. All I ever had to do was use whatever comps are available and adjust the values according to the differences or go outside of 1 mile and detail why you had to do that in your comments. Those are really your only two options.

Hey ech0es, have you read the Pay It Forward threads that are stickied at the top of this forum? You will gain gobs of good tips there.

barb43: Great! when I'll need a tip I'll look that up, but in the mean time, let's just leave this thread to help the ones that need it. Thanks.

I think everyone should read the sticky threads and Pay it Forward threads - if you have a great tip that is not there already - please add it under the given guidelines.

We all learn, sooner or later here, it is nearly pointless to try and dictate the exact content of a thread - just like trying to get people to bump an old thread up on a subject rather then starting a new thread. (I know you searched before starting this one - right )

I know we all hope you got the above assignment done - but I was uncertain if you needed help on that and this was a way of asking for it or there was a specific point you were making.

Along those lines - I was assigned an order this week that was put on hold and probably will be cancelled because the property was rezoned commercial and currently is being used as a 'Day Care' facility. They insisted it was SFR, at first. So I sent pics - they said - oh we should have seen that when we pulled the data up (No data in Tax Records) it says zoned commercial right here, but don't worry I'll try and get you a trip fee - LOL

Of course the comps were pulled when they insisted - but with some sweet talk they actually came through for me - and I will show them my appreciation for not getting stiffed - again

This is my first time in the Forum. Lots of good info here. I am just breaking into the BPO area, and have received a couple of orders. My question is probably stupid, but please bear with me. Can you give me a rule of thumb for the difference (percentage) on the 90, 120, 180 day marketing?

Every market is different. Only you know how this applies to your Territory.

In a stable market, how much can you expect to get for that asset today, or in a 30 Day Quick Sale ? and with greater exposure, in 90 days, 120 or 180 days ?

In a declining or depreciating market, dropping at x% per month, what will be the likely price that might be achieved 90, 120 or 180 days out ?

And in a bouyant or appreciating market, where values might be growing at a certain % per month, what price do you anticipate can be projected onto those future (and better) times that we all anticipate will be coming ?

These projections just help a Lender in decision making and determining what the costs of delay are in taking action on a problem loan.

I was afraid of that : ) I know we are probably in one of the more stable markets in the country, but the one I have been assigned has no sales even close to the type of property and sqft for the past year in the entire city. I am being forced to go 11 miles away to find similar properties, and the majority of those were short sales or foreclosures! I know they don't want us to use a lot of foreclosures, but it truly is indicative of that particular market area.

Thank you for your help. I really appreciated the fast reply.

Typically, if a Market/Territory is REO driven; then those are the Comps you have to use. I'd say, just make sure that ALL the Comps are REO Properties . . . . so that we're still involved in comparing Apples with Apples. The BPO Firm should recognize the necessity of this type of handling . . . . if explained.

Someone else will be able to supplement/contradict my thoughts.

If the bpo doesn't ask specifically if it's an REO- you can include that info in your comments for that comparable, etc. If the majority are short sales or foreclosures- that's the market snap shot you have to work with. That's the market here and avoiding those comparables would be giving the bpo an innacurate twist- imho.

Welcome to the forum! A big woo hoo on getting your first bpo orders. If you go through the pages of threads here you'll get some great information that will help you. You can also search the forum for more specific issues.

Thanks! I've done a little looking around here but will do lots more. Think this would be great to look at at night when I'm not distracted by the phone, etc.

Holy Toledo...I never knew BPO's were that complicated so I will give you some good advice ( I think, I said this before and got bombed) Stay in the neighborhood if you can, if you can't, use age & distance. Get one better ond one worse, then find one that is the same on the sale side. Forget the list side unless there are REO's. Look out for the short sales for they will mess you up. They want an approximation of value and selling time. Actually that is a little out moded, in a depreciating environment; it is likely that the longer the time, the less you will get; but NEVER say that in a BPO. Also, always assume that the QC guy is merely trying to get this piece of paper past the next guy, just like you are.
All that said, best of luck and tell OCWEN to go to hell. Stupidest thing I ever did, but it was 2004 and who needed their little crap.

What I have learned in my few months on the forum is when in doubt with an issue do the following 3 things and you'll probably be okay. I am sure others can add to this, but as I see it...

1) Refer to FAQs on the bpo/reo website and/or contact your AM/bpo provider to see how to proceed,
2) Use this forum, search function, refer to prior tips and tricks, start a thread if needed
3) Do what your gut says and comment about it as much as possible to explain why you did it and why it makes sense to have done it that way.

Last year, I had a drive-by order for an estate home on 1.5 acres. It was the beginning of the year. Absolutely no comps - most were either same-aged homes on .12/ac lots or 1+ acre lots with older and much smaller homes. I decided to use the larger lots and adjust for the homes with explanations. The VM was not happy with that and kept sending it back with QC comments. I called and told her the only other way was to pull newer homes on much smaller lots. She said that wasn't acceptable either and told me to research out further. I told her I checked a 5-mile radius and if I went out any further, I would be in the next city. I didn't think those would be appropriate and I'm sure that there probably weren't any comparables anyway. It was the time where nothing was selling. Anyway, we couldn't seem to come to an agreement on what kind of comps to provide. All she kept saying is that the customer is expecting this BPO and we need to produce one. I finally asked her to re-assign it as I was not able to find comparables. She had just sent me another order and said if she reassigned the order, she would also take the new one away. I'm like, whatever. Needless to say I haven't received any further orders which really kind of hurts because they also give listings. Oh well, sometimes, it just isn't worth the time working with people that are unreasonable.

I've probably commented using this phraseology with the QC of every BPO Firm out there. It works MOST of the time . . . .

"These are the best comparables available. We can make adjustments in value to correct for: GLA; Age; Lot Size; and Quality of Construction of the Comparable Properties; however, we cannot Manufacture or Clone Comparables which are EXACTLY like the Subject.

"My BPO is an “Opinion” of value expressed at this “Point in Time”, based upon an examination of those properties which currently populate the Marketplace. I cannot activate others to satisfy the needs of this BPO."

LOL ... I like the "we cannot Manufacture or Clone Comparables which are EXACTLY like the Subject ... I cannot activate others to satisfy the needs of this BPO" part

In this case I have almost universally found the house rules and you adjust for the value of the land. But they all seem to hate when you use new construction to comp out a older home.

Also wondering why the beginning of the year meant no comps. Is it since it is winter and the market is slow? I usually get approval to go back 1 year if market is slow.

Cat... I've run into a few instances where there were ZERO comps. I called the client and explained I searched beyond the radius scope (up to 5 mi for suburban and 30 mi for rural). I explained that I was certain my BPO would be rejected based on lack of comps and explained how far I went in broadening the search criteria. I tell them it needs to be referred to a "licensed appraiser" based on the necessity of expanding search criteria far beyond the acceptable scope of a BPO. I've been thanked for the opinion (of course after servere interogation about the scope of my search peramiters). They agreed that they would refer it back to the client for recommendation for appraisal servcices verses BPO service and I wasn't blacklisted for refusing to complete the BPO. I know... some clients just don't get it, but this response has worked for me. If you run into this situation again, try it.

I had another Interior recently... this was a CAN OF WORMS! I found out from the point of contact for access that it was being used for litigation purposes and she was expecting an appraisal! Called the BPO company and they said they were only approved for a BPO order, not an appraisal... they demanded I proceed. Got a call back again from the point of contact saying "go ahead... appt is now scheduled for such and such time... she agreed it was to be a BPO verses an appraisal. Got to thinking about this and I thought.... I'm doing a lousy $85 Interior to be used in court??? No thank you! Called back 24 hrs before the scheduled appt and said this should really be an appraiser's job if it's being used for litigation purposes... please re-assign. I said I was not comfortable doing a BPO for dispute between borrower & lender (I found this out from the homeowner when he called me to confirm the appt). The BPO client said they wouldn't want me to do an evaluation if I wasn't comfortable with the circumstances and they thanked me for my honesty. I thought for sure I'd be blacklisted but I still get the normal flow of orders from them. Sometimes we just have to say NO!!!! Even if the consequences mean the risk of losing the client.

Good to know that some bpo companies don't can you for refusing work that could get you in more expense than what you would do the bpo for

Although, I am not endorsed or affiliated with NABPOP, I would highly recommend adopting their BPO Standards and Guidelines. I've printed out a copy of both and keep them close-by when doing BPO's.

Lots of companies have already adopted their program in place of what they had before...thankfully! Thus making things even easier to learn because of having identical guidelines and requirements.

Here's to hoping more and more companies adopt the BPOSG as well!

You can google search them to find out more!