Well, I left my office today, mainly because I think their policy of not allowing their agents to have their own website as stupid and myopic. I have had a blog for some time and today the broker/owners realized that my blog is successful and competing with them. They told me that I couldn't do it.

I told them that I would be resigning, then.

I didn't want to leave, but they left me no choice. I am looking forward to starting at Weichert REALTORS later this week! Imagine this...the owner actually wants the agents to generate their own business and their own leads! Crazy, huh?

I would still interview with more agencies.

Strike the with
I would still interview more agencies.

So please share what dumbass company this is that you were working for....??

It was a mom and pop shop

I would definitely second the "interview with more" idea. If you can, interview with every brokerage in your area and see what all of them have to offer before deciding where to go (it will help you avoid an unnecessary move in the future...and at the very least will give you piece of mind that where you're at is where you should be)

I don't have time for that. I have hot buyers and I do not want to lose them while I shop around...they are ready to buy NOW. Their EBA with my former office has been expired for 2 weeks now, so they are free to be my agents, and they didn't care for any of the houses I showed them previously. I need to have my license hanging somewhere by Friday.

you are doing all of the work, go for the split and pay for your own training. teh training that you want.

Good Luck Perky, though Im sure you don't need luck!!!!

Perky Realtor ---

Congratulations!

I used to live in the D.C. area. My wife used to work for a Weichert agents as an assistant.

Great company. They have a tremendous value package for their agents and customers. I was extremely impressed.

Best of luck in the future!

I am going to calm down and wait before I do anything more rash. I haven't signed anything with anyone yet, so I'm just going to put on the PAUSE button and then have a glass of wine.

It's been a very stressful 2 days. LOL

You know I'm thinking about your best interests. Don't think short term, think long term.

Weichert might truly be a great company and the best office for you now. I have to agree with estatereal Even older "established" offices like Century 21 are seeing the importance of being competitive in the marketplace. I'm not saying that it has to be RE/MAX, shop around. Interview with every possible office.





Best of luck in the future!

I know. I have to stop being hasty. I need to get past this week, and then see what happens.

Dig.

Relax...think things through with a calm head. Having until Friday to decide where to hang your license is not a huge rush - take some time, interview as many brokers as you can in a week (you should be able to interview at least 3-4 per day), then whomever you decide to hang your license with, just have them fax over the required forms before close of business on Friday and you're all set. Choosing a brokerage is not a decision you should take lightly or "because you've got hot buyers that you need to work with by Friday". Take a second and step back from the situation and make a good long-term decision. Changing brokerages can be expensive and is not something you want to do unless you absolutely have to (showing instability to your sellers is not a good thing...). Take your time and make a good and informed choice.

personally i would put up business cards on my basement wall(of different brokers), close my eyes and throw a dart. the card closest to the dart wins! that is how i make most important decisions. well that or paper, rocks, scissors.. best 2 out of 3 takes the win.


perky,

you can do waht you like but it is easier to stay in a place you are happy with then bouncing around all the time. i am not at my first brokerage either, and i will say that

i took my time and interviewed the brokers to decide if i wanted to hire them or not.

let me tell you training is not what it is about. brokers offer training so that they can recruit newbies at a horrible commission and plunder their 50% of the commission and then let the noob wash up and by that time there are more newbies taht are recruited. the trainig that most places offer is just enough to motivate agents to go solicit the 2-3 sales they can find and then when the new agent goes through those sales they have trouble learning how to procure business and then they wash up. most of hte great training can be learned through reading and studying, talking wiht senior producing agents.

learn teh contracts through and through. and then learn them again. and again. learn everything that you can about marketing and statistics and the numbers game and then figure out different ways of procuring business and the different roi's for each of them. make a tight schedule and stick to it.


make hte decision now and stick with it.

go somewhere that you can see yourself in 5 years!!!!!!!!!! make sure that you like the commission split because once you dont need the constant handholding you wont want the horrible commission split!!!!!!

it is about the money,----- i mean people leave their job everyday for a job with better pay. here in this business the fastest way to get more money is to get a better split. the next fastest way is to procure business at a higher rate!

That's good advice...but really, what about the power of the name for securing listings?

I know that I can get buyers easy, but what about the listings? I really do not want to work for any of the local big name offices except for the Weichert one...because I have heard all sorts of nonsense about all of them, and the one owner of the biggest office is a total...slime. I even get the creeps talking to him on the phone. I have two other mom and pop ones in mind that will offer me better commission and more flexibility re: office time and won't be retards about a website - but what about getting listings? I do not see many of their signs around...but
Weichert signs are all over the place here.

Of course, it's mainly the listings of agents who were wildly successful at their last office, which was a mom and pop...

*sigh*

name is crap.

on my website i have my company name the size of the realtor logo nad the equal housing logo in the bottom corner of my company. i am selling me!!!!!!!!

i have been hired and had clients ask ---so who do you work for?

remember if you build a business based on a company name what does that say about you when you leave that company? are you then going to say the same about the new company? why not just build yoru name!

would i do a better job at remax or exit or kw or opf or era?

i educate people that we are independent contractors and that they are hiring the person to do the job. i let them know that if htey interveiw 5 different agents from 5 different companies we could all be offering different things adn that it is just teh place i hang my license to run my business.

less than 10% of my business is soi... my business is from solicitation. so that means that they use me based on my material and how i present it not based on my reputation that they have no idea about!!!!!!


i sent you a pm

Perky,

If Weichert is the best place for you to be, then by all means go to Weichert. I am only suggesting that you Explore all of your options. Do not go somewhere solely based on a gut feeling. Usually your first instinct is right, but in this case you have not given any of the other offices a real chance. You have dismissed them based on "hearsay" or all sorts of nonsense that you have heard about them.

It is very costly to make a move from office to office. It is better to make the move now, before you have multiple listings, buyers, pendings, name recognition, signage, etc. That is why hugely successful agents stay put in their particular office, because they do not want to loose business. You are in a perfect position, to make a clean break with a minimal loss. Trust me, if you loose the commission from your pending, one or two listings and a couple of buyers now, it will not hurt near as bad as being at a office for a year or two or three or more, then making a move.

This is a hard business to be make it financially. There are several factors for you to take in account and to decide if it is the right office. The power of the brand name for securing listings is very important, especially for a newbie. Granted, it is ultimately your skills that will determine if you succeed. Which leads to training, if you have the desire, dedication, and the discipline then you can get the training and skills yourself. Freedom and flexibility also have to play a part in your decision. If you are required to attend office meetings, office house tours, floor time, or be in the office at a certain time that might not be practical for you and your family. I personally would not want a Broker who competes with me for listings and buyers. I also would not want to work in a family type brokerage. You need to ask, who gets the call, walk-in, or Internet leads that come into the office. You must have the freedom to have your own web site and blog. (DUH) Who gets your sign calls or ad calls on all your listings? Do they come into the office or can you have your phone number on the sign and advertisements. What about office support: secretarial, copy machines, closing coordinator, ad layout, dress code, etc. Office or desk space, access to the office etc. Finally, the most important, commission splits and or fees. Ask yourself, how much do you want to make and do the math. Your commission split has to be the overriding factor.

I'm sure you can get buyers easy, but what about the listings? Listings is the key in making it in this business. If you control the listings, you control the market. I can get you a laptop listing presentation that I learned from (IMHO) the best trainer on the subject. Rich Casto. I know I have been harping on Brian Buffini but this listing presentation is top notch. Having said that, estatereal is missing the boat on SOI. You need to do the Buffini thing and take advantage of some of the other training available on Mainstreet. 90% of Estatereal's business is derived from solicitation, that is not how you want to do business. You want repeat and referral where your reputation does mean something.

If Weichert signs are all over the place there that is great. How do they compare with ALL the other search criteria including commission splits with ALL of the other agencies. Please check them out. Trust me, If it is this hard to make the transition now, what will it be like four years down the road. You really do not want to move again if you can help it. Know all of your options! Good luck!

Read the Keller Williams: myth or reality post and the Re: Re/Max (sic) Agents? post.

I did read the Keller Williams thread. I had started to read the RE/MAX thread the other day.

I'll finish reading that one tomorrow.

Thank you for the well thought out posts. I do intend on developing my SOI and I don't want to bounce from office to office. good points on the training, that i can get myself - heck, I taught myself web design and SEO... lol. I guess my biggest concern is getting listings. I know that having listings is key.

right now though I'm finishing my website that I've been secretly working on for months.

a company will not get you listings by default. Even weichert with their website lead strategy...those leads get passed around the office...it will most likely be rare to get one, and when you do, they charge you an extra 35% referral fee (that 35% comes out before your split with the broker)...not necessarly the best way to start a listing...If you are thinking you can rely on "the company" to hand you listings, you will starve. Be proactive - meet people, sell yourself (not your company), do an incredible job and earn referrals!

I wasn't think about the company handing me listings; I was thinking about people being more willing to sign with a "big name", particularly one that is plastered all over two counties, over a mom and pop small company with relatively few signs up in comparison.

I knew about the Weichert Lead system - before you can even qualify to get the leads from Weichert.com you have to take several of their courses and take their FastTrack training or something like that.

I'm not looking for a big name to give me leads, but to beef up my presentation.

RE/MAX does not charge referral fee's either. I have only gotten an average of 2 to 3 a year from my office that were walk-ins or call-ins ($7500). Lead street on the other hand has already paid my "desk fee" of $19500 for the year.

One of the most critical things to consider is who the Broker is and how you feel about that person. You are working as his representative, so do you trust that person and can you go to him/her with questions. I agree that training can be gotten independently of the company. There are a lot of great trainers out there. Name recognition is important, but respecting the ethics and having a rapport with the Broker are crucial IMNSHO

I thought I had that with my last broker....but I was mistaken.

You want the 800 pound gorilla.

I got the following stats from a Live Training seminar from Brian Buffini. I'm sure he did not make them up.



Then you compile all of the different RE/MAX office stats together for your local area.

Once you have a track record for yourself, you incorporate them in. If asked about you being a rookie, simply say; "I will work hard for you, if something ever arises that I do not know the answer, I'm only one phone call away from years of experience."

Having said that, estatereal is missing the boat on SOI. You need to do the Buffini thing and take advantage of some of the other training available on Mainstreet. 90% of Estatereal's business is derived from solicitation, that is not how you want to do business. You want repeat and referral where your reputation does mean something.



if missing the boat means that a newer agent (like me) can close several transaction sides per month then i will miss the boat anyday.


i PICK the houses that i want to list. when it is a referal business you take what comes your way because you have a personal obligation to the people that you have been working for so long. i run every transaction as a business decision not a touchy feely care bare festival. this is a business not a country club. i would rather work with people who look at me as a real estate professionaly as opposed to the real estate guy who throws cook out's every weekend and is always there to talk to on the phone(that does not pay my bills).

i took a listing yesterday, have a listing appointment today going against one of the powerhouses in the area, one of the big 5 teams and htese guys hit hte exp and fsbo's just like i do, so it should be good to see how this turns out. also they ahve been working this couple for a month and we have not met this couple yet. we have asked them not to sign any paperwork until we can show what we have to offer and then make the best decision based on what they see. the other guys were supposed to be going over to sign paperwork today!

it is not hard to make it you just have to have a competitive strategy. telling a client how you are the best does not work when everybody says that. you need options, plans and a competitive edge to get the listing more times than not.

there are agents out there who like to say htat htey have been in the business for 5/9/15/20 years, when the truth is that some agents have been in the business for their first year and repeated it 5/9/15/20 years.

the market is different than it was in 2k5 one of the dominant agents has had all of her soi calls dry up and she has no idea how to solicit the listings. i have total confidence that in any market with the right gameplan an agent can flourish.

perky give me a call.

Some agents do not want to "solicit". Have you not read her posts? Pay attention. That is great working FSBO's and expireds work for you, but have you ever listened to a Buffini presentation?

i understand that, and can respect that perky does not want to knock on a door, there are ways that she can do it without knocking. i remember a post quite some time ago where she was speaking about her neighbor who she had solicited about the listing. i dont remember all of the details, but that is a perfect scenario for pulling the listing in. that is not soi business. she can solicit her neighborhood with a powerful newsletter that HELPS the neighbors. in the flyer she can be persuasive as to why somebody would want to use her.


we all solicit, just in different ways. i dont see how we can get business without solicitation of some sort.

Estatereal,

I agree with you on most of your posts. I.E. Go for the most commission split. There just has to be more factors involved. I.E. Deepseas post, Man from the band, and my criteria for picking an agent etc.

You should check out Buffini as well.

I do have a child to consider. The one Weichert office I spoke to said I would need to be on the floor three to five days a week until 5 pm if I wanted to be considered "full time." I just don't want to do that. I do not want to be "tied" to another office.

The other office I'm considering is a mom and pop, without required floor time. I don't know the commission split though. I need to talk to the broker about it. What I like though is the flexible office hours. I want to be able to work around my family requirements. So if that means taking a smaller commission split so that I can have the flexibility I need so be it. I have not talked to the other Weichert office yet.

I'm with Re/Max. I don't really use all the Bells and whistles that they offer on their intranet (I actually just discovered them) but it has great flexability. I work from home, I'm in the office just to turn in contracts or checks.

The splits are good, but then there are high office expenses. These days I'm lucky if I see the Broker every two weeks because of being busy.

I'm not promoting one company or another for you Perky, just telling you how I operate.

what is the difference between being "considered" part time or full time?

are there benefits that they offer for what they consider "full time"?


what do you loose by being considered "part time"?


there should not be any flexibility about hours worked. you are an independent contractor. if they are giving me benefits and pay then i might let them tell me what kind of hours to work, until then i will work for an office that has an independent contractor agreement that i sign that does not require floor time.

I think the idea was to be considered for "floor time" and to be able to answer phones and take leads/walk ins. They said their office is crazy busy.

But, I have heard THAT tune before...while sitting in an office that gets NO walk ins and maybe two or three upcalls a week...

Yes Perky_REALTOR please interview with other companies besides Weichert, there has to be somebody better in your area than them. They are so bad for you in many respects that it just hurts to think of you going their. Also they highly discurage their agents from having their own websites as well, Unless you are a top producer that is.

Check out what one of their customers had to say about them.

http://www.whyweichertsucks.com

it is eye opening.

Not true about "highly discouraging" websites, they do not discourage websites nor do you have to be a top producer. They will try and get you to purchase one of their website through I think Fidelity but you are free to go off and do your own thing. The majority of agents go off on their own because the agent sites are very limitted as to what you can do.

To use whyweichertsucks.com as an example doesn't say much about the company. Every company has a pissed off customer with pretty much the same scenario. I am sure some facts were left out.

If you really wanted to clutter her mind in making a judgement visit ripoffreport.com, KW is no angel nor is all the others. Given their short history compared to others they might soon lead the pack in complaints. Their rap sheet on the BBB is long as well maxed out the 200 complaints visible. The whole point to this is that it is easy to clutter one's decision making.

The bottom line is to ignore everything you read Perky, do your interviews and go with the who fits you the best like what has been mentioned. Unfortunately "the dream broker" doesn't exist IMO. You'll be successful at Re/Max, KW, Weichert, Prudential, CB, C21 and all the others as long as you want to be and if that's your mindset.

What it does say about the company is that corp, which is what controls all the offices in New Jersey and of the total of the offices I think they are still 75% corp, sure does not have a clue how to deal with a customer service issue before it gets totally blown out of the water and flamed up.

The customer in this case was so mad that he worked on that site to the point that for a long time if you Googled Weichert that site would come up 4th or 5th. Yet still corp did nothing about it from what is said on that website. If they were at all smart they would have cut that guy loose from the listing contract, paid him, and forced him to sign a keep quiet agreement, but they did not even have the smarts for that.

As far as the websites, I should have said highly discourages, which at this point would be more accurate, and it what nearly every weichert agent I have spoken with says.

As far as the BBB I am not surprised that they have more than 200 complaints for KW, but keep in mind they are a much bigger company than Weichert, I believe the numbers are now 75,000 Realtors for KW and 20,000 Realtors for Weichert. When I left Delaware Weichert was down to less than 5% of the transactions after being as high as 30% within the last 10 years, Why such a drop, is wasn't because of getting a real bad reputation with the public, it was because their best agents kept leaving, You can make your own assumptions as to why, I know what mine are.

I would not "ignore" everthing you read but take with a grain of salt. The key thing is to do your interviews. Pick the office that is the best for you and your needs.

I wish I interviewed with all of the offices here in Evansville when I started. I have way too much invested to ever leave now.

I'm happy with RE/MAX but I do not have a frame of reference.

You are in a unique situation. Go interview with all of the offices and pick the best one for you.

You have a lot of agents pulling for you.

I guess I am being to negative here, I have never worked for the W company though 33% of the agents in my office were W agents before coming to our office, and the stories I have herd just make my hart sink, the stories about the treatment of the agents, how everything is for Jim W, how their stratagy is to just bring as many agents in as possible, (Throw as much mud at the wall as possible, see what sticks) and if each agent just does one deal with mom, or dad or younger sister, then that is more for Jim W. All of that is kind of Re-enforced by what I went though interviewing with them 4 years ago, then moving to New Jersey and their multiple efforts to recruit me, telling me that not coming to Weichert was the biggest mistake of my life, and that joining KW was so stupid, and how Weichert was going to run KW out of the State of New Jersey, I mean really. They may think they are going to, but the ever improving numbers for the KW office tell a different story.

Perky_REALTOR Interview all the offices, don't just surrender to joining W make sure that their isn't a better option first.

Maybe you should eat crow, go back to the old office, collect your commission and leave next Monday

too late. they made me leave my key, and I smashed my company coffee mug.

do you remember the printer in the movie office space?

I didn't see that movie. Should i?

yes.. it is with jennifer aniston and i forget the other actors. a very good movie. have you ever heard anyone reference "sounds like you have a case of the mondays"!


rent or buy it ASAP and let me know how much you laugh. anyone who works or has worked in an office or corporate america would love that movie.

Perky,

Here is an Office Space Clip.

milton cracks me up. him and his darn swingline stapler:-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnUrPjXczYc&mode=related&search=

Okay, I'll have to add it to my Blockbuster Queue.

One of the brokers I've talked to is non-competitive. He does not believe in competing with his agents.

Hmmmm!!

good. on the blockbuster thing, and great on the broker not competing with you.

you have the bene of knowing what you dont want from being at your old broker.



how many places have you checked out?

three. I'm making my decision tomorrow though. I can't stand being in limbo.

Actually, I have pretty much made up my mind...but mums the word for now in case I change it before tomorrow!

I was on the phone literally all day today, talking to brokers, talking to the board of realtors executive, talking to lawyers, calming the nerves of my former listing client who called me to tell me he "has a new agent.." and telling him that the new agent the office assigned to him will be a great realtor, talking to agents who were checking up on me to see if I was okay.

After a day of bi polar craziness, I finally have peace of mind and know that I will come out of this like Steve Austin: better, stronger, faster.

Well, I don't know about faster, but I have plans on being the Six Million Dollar Realtor!!! lol

Wow, and I haven't even had any caffeine tonight!

Well, I'm sure that there are a lot of horror stories out there - and I have heard similar stories about some of the local franchises - that everything is for the owners/brokers and the peon realtors get the crumbs.

In this area, Weichert has a good reputation and agents are flocking to them. Weichert is a fairly new kid on the block and both of the Weichert offices are doing very very well.

Let me say that I am basing my decision after talks I have had with all of the principal players involved.

good for you - i'm glad you took the time to interview and get some more perspective for yourself. I'm on my third broker and only now feeling like I'm comfortable where I am (I interviewed 10 brokers before I chose my FIRST and I STILL had to make some moves as I grew/matured as an agent..)

Let me say this...I know that one agent got her license the same time as me - in January. She started working for Weichert at the same time I was working as an assistant.

She is now closing her fourth deal. I'm closing my first and have no others in sight at the moment except for about three buyers who may buy now, or they may buy six months from now.

You need to sign up for Net Flix. Remember you need to watch The Secret Blockbuster is taking forever.

What Broker did you talk to that was non-competitive? Is he on the short list?

If you are going to watch a movie for entertainment only value watch Barfly with Mickey Rourke & Faye Dunaway loosely about Charles Bukowski filmed in 1987.

Here is one of my favorite lines.

"To all my friends"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5qcjExvEUc


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g9Kb8mGkYX4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNW3HZTo10w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Blh_gzbrqSo

I know - the secret still hasn't come yet!!!

I will watch the clips tomorrow...shhhh hubby is sound asleep.

The non-competing broker is from a short list, yes. There are three offices in the running. One other office, #4, I considered briefly but decided that it would not be a good idea for me because of personal issues.

There are several things about Weichert that you should be aware of.

-They take fees from you in every direction. They take 6% off the top of every transaction for "marketing". They charge $100 for each listing transaction for "portfolio".

-They do not encourage agents to have their own sites. They try to forbid agents from putting site addresses on their business cards. They only allow you to put your perkyrealtor@weichert.com email address on the cards, so if you leave they get your emails.

-Every marketing effort they do is now funneled into the leadnetwork, so your listings get advertised on TV or in the paper, but the ONLY contact information for customers is the 1800 number which goes straight to leadnetwork. IF you are in LN, you'll get that customer (if you answer your cell fast enough) but Weichert will keep an additional 35% of the commission.

-Their customer service IS appalling. There is no accountability from the people in their corporate office. They really don't care if they lose a deal or two. It hurts the AGENT, not the company, so it's no big deal to them.

Some agents are very successful with Weichert, but it's at a price. If you are willing to follow their rules and "Jim Weichert is God" philosophies like a sheep, you'll love it. If you can think for yourself, market yourself, want to keep your commission and realize that the company is irresponsible and poorly managed, then you should look elsewhere.

Weichert is a significant presence in my market; I know a number of their agents and have worked with quite a few of them. With the exception of one agent who just left Weichert because she was fed up with the fees and control issues, all the other agents I know well are some of their heaviest producers and don't seem to be too bothered by the negatives. As new agents, they leveraged the Weichert name and have been hugely successful.

I have also talked to a number of newer agents who do complain about the perceived "nickel and diming"; each managing broker is different, but at one office in particular, I have heard from multiple agents that they hound them about using affiliated services, such as title companies and the in house lender, to the point of embarrassing individuals at sales meetings.

Until this topic came up, I never gave any thought to the technological side of Weichert, but I will say this -- one of my frustrations in working with the Weichert agents with whom I have dealt is that not one of them responds to email very well AND in just checking quickly on the web, the top producing agents I know simply do not have a web presence other than that provided by the company, which does make me wonder about how much control they exert over their agents in that regard. Again, that may be solely anecdotal and reflective only of the offices with which I am familiar, but the post above does ring true.

I really really really think that it is different at each office...because neither of the Weichert offices I checked said anything about a $100 listing fee when I asked about fees and what is paid for by me vs. paid for by them. Both of the managers of both offices I spoke to said they wish their agents would all have their own websites...both of them said they want their agents to be productive and creative and do everything they can to generate business. I could see that there were definite - and quite stark - differences between the two offices I have checked out....from how floor time is handled to who answers the phones, to the commission structures, to the way they do open houses.

to the way they do open houses.

^ what do you mean?
:
:

my broker has nothing to do with how an open house is or is not done.

Let me rephrase that to say that Weichert evidently has a technique that works and therefore does open houses more correctly.

This one office is a very hands on office - the broker is actually there training his agents in the office two days every week. New agents shadow experienced agents a bit and then the experienced agent shadows the new agent while he/she attempts to fly on his/her own. I know that some offices require a new agent to agree to pay their mentor from their first two commission checks...and you know, that just seems fair to me. If they're sharing their experience and technique with you, darn tooting they should get paid!

I for one do not like to be used for my knowledge and skill and be taken advantage of.

I personally would not work at an office that either requested, required, encouraged, or expected their agents to either answer the company phones, do open houses, or handle walk-ins - "Floor Time".

If I chose to do a Open House, it was my call. As far as floor time or answering the company phone that is handled by our receptionist. Leads are rotated with NO Referral Fee to the agents unless they were calling on a listing of one of our agents. All of my sign, ad, or mls calls come to me directly because my phone number is listed. If for some reason a call did come to the office that was for my listing, they forwarded it to me. Same thing with the answering service after office hours.

Now tell, how did they handle the commission structure?

So does Brian Buffini, Rich Casto, Richard Robbins, etc.

According to NAR
1% of homes are sold because of the open house.
8% of "buyers" are picked up as a result of open houses.

I do open houses, because I learned from Rich Casto at a seminar how to pick up buyers at open houses. Having said that, I can't wait till I do not have to ever do an open house again. Time is better spent working your SOI and going on listing presentations. Eventually I would like to just list homes and not work with buyers. We will refer them out or have a buyers agent. It takes four times as long working with a buyer.

i am wiht cool cat.

mandatory floor time and answering hte phones sounds like a way to get a free receptionist!

how can an office tell an independent contractor how they should run an open house or how to deal with clients. as long as the agent is within hte law that in my book should be the end of teh road. i understand taht there might be stipulations in an IC agreement. remember that once you get the experience you wont want the broker in your face. often times i notice that the brokers use the "i am always here to help, and i am in your face training all the time" line as a way to validate the high amount of commision that they take. you are in the future going to want a broker who will answer questions when needed but does not get in your business unlness you ask. make sure that hte commission split is going to be acceptable after you are there for a year or 2 because you wont want to change brokers down the road.

The biggest difference in the two offices to me was -

the first office, I could barely comprehend the commission structure. It appeared to me that you started out at like, 30 percent but I couldn't quite figure it out. Since I'm a relatively smart girl, I decided that there must have been a page missing. lol. at anyrate, they told me in simple terms that it was a sliding scale and it resets at the bottom every year, which is exactly how my old office did it. You started at 60/40 and after you earn 20,000, you get 65/35. But in January, you start at 60/40 again. I really could not see, from the paperwork, where you started with the first office.

The second office is 50/50 (I know! I know!) but as you produce more you get more. Eventually you get to 65/35 but it stays that way as long as you remain consistent over a six month period. so if you're getting 65/35 in december, you'll still get it in January.

Almost every office around here except the RE/MAX office starts agents out at 50/50. To my knowledge, all of them "reset" if you are on a sliding scale. This office does not. One or two offices do give 80/20 but I have good reasons (which are personal and must remain so) for not going to either of those offices.

The 2nd Weichert office is appealing to me because I like the owners, I know them fairly well, and I have seen how they work. They are people to learn from. And they are willing to teach. I have been in a "go ahead and do your thing" office and I don't like it. I want to shadow these top producers and learn from them and they are so willing to teach what they know!

I can not afford desk fees. I will not, will not, will not consider working at the RE/MAX office...nothing against you Cool Cat, but I have definite reasons why I do not want to be associated with them in any way shape or form. I am not ranking all RE/MAX offices the same and I know they are all different. The one that is convenient for me is not where I want to have my license.

The 2nd weichert office is more flexible and laid back re: floor time. The first one told me that to be "full time" I would have to commit to being there 5 days a week, until 5pm!! That is just nuts! And I couldn't do that until I took 12 training sessions AND took their FastTrack training. The second office said that they do want agents to be trained but they train you as you go as they want you to get started right away.

The first office seemed to be run like a military school. the second one is much more my style.

The third office I considered is very unique and I have decided to step away from that office again for undisclosed personal reasons. I sound mysterious, but that is part of my aura.

It's not that way. I tell you what: if what I was told about their open house success is true, then I will do whatever they tell me!

(they did not tell me their techniques or what have you, just their results).

I compared that to the results my former office had whenever they held an open house and from what I was told by others in other agencies - and Weichert blows them out of the water.

My former office owner sat all alone at an open house with food and a bunch of bottled water and nobody showed up. Meanwhile, across town, one of my former real estate class mates was accepting a full price offer on her open house.

I see that same class mate is closing her 4th deal since we got our licenses (almost the same time). And I...am just closing my first, and I was just as gung ho. Only thing was, I was in a stifling office, while she was being nurtured and trained to succeed.

---BTW--- they have a receptionist / secretary. they just have agents on hand to actually talk to upcalls when they come in. The receptionist can not answer real estate questions, and people who are calling like to actually talk to an agent.

Very important question to ask: Do you control your commissions. If not, you're at a competitive disadvantage with other agents. I would not work for a firm where I cannot price my services. Sometimes I won't take less than 6% but on certain higher priced homes, I am free to be creative. Both on the total commission charge AND the co-broke split.

Also, 65% MAX is an absolute no-go. 75% would be a minimum with no slide-back.

As far as desk fees, you're paying them whether you think so or not. They might be called a 50/50 split, but you ARE paying them.

Yes, I realize that. But I can't pay a monthly fee, let me put it that way. If I start tomorrow and if I sell a house tomorrow, chances are it will be a good 45-60 days before I even close and that's if all goes normally. I can not afford a huge monthly fee in the meantime!

I did mean to ask about the commission fee and I forgot. The last office was very strict about 6% and one agent got in trouble for taking a listing at 5%.

Not to get to personal, but, You did not have unplanned, casual, neighborly, and incidental human contact with anyone in those three offices, did you?

Well, isnt' that sort of controlled by the practices of the agencies around? For one thing, I am brand new and have nothing to stand on were I to say "I demand 75% minimum or I go somewhere else." As I said, the majority of the offices around here start agents out at 50/50. I am willing to trade off and consider my commission split as "tuition" for the training that I'm expecting to get here. If I don't get the training, then I walk, simple as that...just like with my former office.

They made me sign a ridiculous contract cause they said they would not invest time and effort into training me if I were going to go elsewhere. In nearly seven months, all they "trained" me to do was to write up a sales contract and stumble thru some buyers estimated closing costs. Everything else, EVERYTHING ElSE I learned myself or bugged other agents to help me with. I will not let that happen again.

lol. no comment. i plea the 5th.

yep.

if you are 50/50 and you sell 3 million in sales which in my area can be as few as 6 transaction sides. if the co-op is 3% for those deals you would be paying $45,000.00 in desk fees then the 45k that you make gets taxed very high you might make 30k after taxes, but dont forget to take out your expenses for all of those sales that you have. so we will call it a 30k a year which equates to an hourly wage of 14.42 an hour. dont forget all of your realtor fees and the fact that we have to pay our own health insurance which can be over 500 a month. vehicle maintainance, printers internet conections cell phones yada yada yada.....


wow htis is expensive

Yes, I understand that but you are not understanding me. I have no money to pay even one month's desk fees! none! zilch! nada! My husband makes enough money to pay our bills and my dues/mls fees right now - but another chunk of money going out for desk fees would be impossible!

plus as I said, I am not going to work at the local remax office, I don't care if the desk fee is a dollar a day.

and if I made 3 million in sales I'd be at 65/35.

Everyone needs to remember what is best for Perky might not be what is best for anyone of us. And further that what office is bloody fantastic where you are might just plain suck where she is.

After the experiences I've had (which granted, haven't been tons), I've been at a company that starts you at 50/50 and touts training (then for "training" handed me a phone book and said "i recommend you start at "Z"), then went to a 95/5 company that charged $1400/month because i wanted to be around a top producer in the area and the broker said he'd show me more stuff (evidently by not returning calls for 2 weeks at a time, he showed me how to be self-sufficient), and now i'm at my third broker, with a 100% split, $69/month desk fee, $239 fee for first transaction of every month, and $40 E&O every deal with a broker who's not in my face, but is there when i need him to be and I'm finally happy....

I have to say...

the splits are not worth the "training" when you need it to survive your first year...at least not from what i've seen...do your own research and get your own training...get the 100% and you'll never want to go back.

That's been my experience in a nutshell, take it for what it's worth. Ultimately - go where you feel you can best make a living, but don't fall for the "free lunch"...it doesn't exist.

:-)


i know.. i just dont like seeing the horrible commission splits and teh minimal training that brokers have to rationalize the horrible commission splits.

perky, once you start closing some deals you will wonder why the broker is getting teh ammount of money you are giving them out of the business that you generate---then it is time for negotiation regardless of teh stupid scale that they have.

get em girl!!!!!

and check your pm

Just so you know, most REMAX offices around here will take new agents on a "wrap", where they take 30% (the % may vary office to office) until you pay the yearly fee (that varies per office as well averages 12K-15K around here) and then you go on to 95% from there on out. 95% is the most new agents will make in REMAX anymore. There is now a 5% franchise fee. (and I think KW works roughly like this as well, but around here the yearly fee is higher by about 6K)

Is Weichert a franchise or corporate agency? I am surprised they have different policies and commission structure.

What are the "desk fees" at the different RE/MAX offices?
Even though RE/MAX charges a desk fee they will work a split till it is paid. I am surprised that your neck of the woods still go by the archaic method of 50/50 shops. Are Century 21, Coldwell, Prudential, KW, Exit, etc. are all 50/50? Did you interview with them?

You are paying more than a "desk fee" if you start out a lower commission 50/50 or even 65/35 plus you have "flexible and laid back re: floor time"

Each Weichert is independently owned and operated.

That is my thought process exactly. Once I get some numbers behind me and prove that I'm not just another newb with bright eyes and hopes for riches, I feel like I can demand a better split.

I want to go with the Weichert office not so much because of Weichert, but because of the ones who own it, if that makes sense?

If I am in a cross sale with FC Tucker (Large Indiana Franchise) they have strict guidelines on what an agent can and cannot do as far as commissions.

For example, if in negotiations, on a $200,000 house we are off $2000. and it is a deal breaker. I can, if I want to, split the difference and each knock off half a percent. Meaning instead of grossing 7k and after split making $6650. I could "reduce the commission down to 3 from 3.5% and walk with $5700. The Tucker agent will still have to pay their broker $3500. and walk with $2500. The agents are told "If you want to give away your money you can but we (Broker) still want our Full commission". I can't tell you how many deals we cut our commission to make the deal work (with that agent bleeding the most) or how many times the agent would not or could not do it and we lost the deal. I have been also in positions where I had the buyer and seller and reduced my commission to 4% from 7% to make the deal work where as the other agents could not do that. Back before RE/MAX and now the "Discount Houses" when the Brokers had the advantage (Pre Internet) they could dictate your commission structure. Let me repeat On my example I made $5700 where the co-agent made $2500. Ask about their commission Fee Split (flexibility) with the agent

Let me repeat, Are Century 21, Coldwell, Prudential, KW, Exit, etc. are all 50/50? Forgot ERA

One big question you need to ask is - if you have your own website, are you allowed to post your listings on it, or must you just post a link that takes visitors back to the Weichert site? There is a big broo-ha-ha going on with some brokers.

Also, starting over at 12 months? Never heard of such. Your local offices must informally "communicate" with one another. I am much more familiar with a 12-month sliding scale - what you maintain for 12 months GCI is what your split is set at. No one ever drops back to the lowest scale unless they do really poorly.

Splits start at 50/50, but start moving up when an agent hits 27,500 GCI(gross commission income) and the top is 85/15 for the top top producers.

I really hope you are able to talk to several agents at your Weichert franchise for testimonials on their experience. One newbie's success is likely all about her, not necessarily the company. Remember, the brokers are the top dog sales people and are really good at telling you what you want to hear. If you are lacking paperwork that substantiates what they say, you have no way to judge the "fluff" coming out of their mouths. They imply a LOT, because honestly, your success depends on YOU and you alone. Seriously. It matters very little what company you sign with. If you can sell yourself, you have it made. Work on differentiating yourself and you will go far. Good luck!

Perky, you might remember just a little while ago I had decided to leave the team I was on and go to an office with a great training program. I must say, the office, agents and atmosphere are great and so is the training.
I have 5 closings in less than a month with them, but after about my 3rd deal I didn't really need so much training. What I'm saying is that everyone who is telling you to go for the highest split might be right. I'm at a 70/30 split which can increase to 80/20 and 90/10 based on production. Not bad, but imagine if I would have still left the team but stayed at RAMAX. . . With my 5 sales this month I would have put thousands more into my pocket.

Just a little something to think about.

Why does nobody seem to understand this:



Yes, I know. I know, I know.

I want to work for these people because of who they are. I don't give a flying fig, really, if they are Weichert, c21, CB, RE/MAX, or McDonald's. I know that I can learn a LOT from them and right now money is NOT the issue for me. I have wasted the last 7 months at a brokerage with a fairly competitive commission structure and did squat because #1, I was not allowed to have a website and was restricted mainly to farming and advertising in order to generate leads, I kept being placed on the schedule for every other saturday stuck wasting my time in a dead office, being told I was going to be trained, blah blah blah. I was trained by having to wing it, and still not knowing what the he$# I am doing with some of this stuff, with the owners being gone for weeks at a time and when they were there they were "busy" or otherwise occupied to make you feel like you were imposing. I asked for help via email thinking that would be better and my emails like that were ignored and unanswered.

I've seen the numbers for this office. It is crazy - they are one of the top producing offices in the area and they're the newest kids on the block. I've seen the sales. I've been watching this office for months. Yes, two of the top producing agents in the entire area work there. They work there and they say they are willing to train and I see that their newbies are working harder than I was ever able to as far as getting listings and getting OUT in the public's eye.

As for changing brokerages, people do that here as often as they change their clothes, it seems. You never know from one week to the next who is now working for whom. There is no Keller Williams, there is no Exit nearby enough for me to even consider it, there is another office dominated by an old coot who yelled at me on the phone when I called him to ask a question about his listing, and there are two offices where I would be extremely uncomfortable working there because of personal reasons.

I'm getting a little peeved... I want to work for these people. I want to learn to do what they are doing. They have been screwed in the past by others and they want to not be that way. I believe them. They *say* they want to train me to be a success. I know, I have been conned once into believing I'd be trained but I won't be conned again. The numbers don't lie - they are definitely the rising star of this area. Other offices are being blown away by these people!

I have looked at one of their agents' websites and the listings she displays are straight from our local MLS with her profile on the top, they are not fed from Weichert.com (though one of the other agent websites is.)

Weichert is not a cookie cutter company - at least not around here. Each office is independently owned and carries the "personality" of the people who work it and own it. I see agent signs with their name riders on them to call and ask for
that agent. I see other signs that just say Weichert and the office number (which tells me that the listing agent probably didn't buy sign riders yet).

I don't get it. I hear people say "Pick a broker you can work with, pick someone who shares your philosophy, pick this pick that" and when I do pick something that for all intents and purposes appears to be the best fit for me at this point in my life and in my career, I'm being told to check out the offices that are eating the dust of this one.

I will send you a dvd on doing open houses that get traffic and 'buyers" for free.


If Weichert has a commission split policy, then I'm sorry you cannot Demand anything. You will find yourself in the same position as your last office, when they Demanded that you quit your blog and not have a personal web site. They could not allow you to do something that the would not allow the others. Weichert will not let you have a better split over the other agents. If they top out at 75% OMG

When you get some numbers behind you and prove that you can make it as real estate agent. You will "wonder why the broker is getting teh (sic) ammount (sic)of money you are giving them out of the business that you generate."

At that point, when you are making good money and realize the split sux (sic) you will have several in the pipeline. Multiple listings, Multiple Buyers, and Pendings scheduled every few days. You will NEVER be able to quit. That is the problem with most successful agents. You can never walk away. You are in a unique position, someone "helped you in making the break.

Don't say you were going to quit after the pending closed, because you had a hot buyer that might buy Friday Remember If they bought Friday that would have meant you would "postpone" the move till after it closed. Plus you have a listing, suppose that or another sale occurred. Trust me the longer you are in an office and the more sales you get behind you then it will be harder to leave.

Do I have to quote all of your previous posts before the 'firing/quitting" why now you could not make the move to a better agency, because you had a listing and a pending, and a couple of buyers, and a possible listing, etc and could not afford to leave now.

Then when they fired or you quit you had to HURRY up and go to Weichert because you had a HOT buyer. Should I pull up that quote/

PERKY re-read all of the posts (setting a record of posts) because, obviously we all care. Everyone wants you to succeed.

Go there, and be happy.

My only intent was for you to make an educated decision - not a rash one "because you have hot buyers and need a new broker asap".

Whether you've done your homework or not doesn't really matter or affect me in any way - I think everybody here was just saying "know what else is out there before you commit" because it's just plain good advice that we've probably all learned the hard way (read, very expensive way) at some point.

If you're satisfied, then that's awesome. Hopefully we can do business together some day (know anybody moving to FL?). If not, that's ok too.

Oh - one last thing...in your independant contractor agreement with them - make sure that if you ever DO decide to leave Weichert, that you can take your listings with you. I've had quite a few agents come over to my brokerage from Weichert and they gave up tens of thousands of dollars worth of commission to do it because the broker wouldn't release their listings.

Best of luck

I realize that and I need to say thank you to everyone who is helping me.

I have had a very difficult week and am very stressed right now.

I do know that this office allows agents to leave and if they have anything in pending, they are entitled to finish out the deal and receive their commissions.

I need to say that my circumstances changed considerably since I posted that. Something changed that opened up several new options to me. So, my current decision was not made out of desperation but rather, it is the one I have wanted for months now.

Perky REALTOR ---

I think this discussion has gotten out of control.

You've made a decision and you've gotten flack by folks who don't know you personally nor the ins and outs of your decision.

I encourage you to stay away from this board for a week or two. Get settled in and on your way. Then come back.

Best of luck!

good that you can get commissions from your pending sales...what about your "active listings" that you've spent YOUR time and money to garner, and that you've been spending YOUR time and money to market for possibly months? What happens to those?

That was the best post in this thread. The reason why I have not said much.

Maybe I'll be smart and keep that in mind if I'm planning on making a move....one of the agents I know who left their office listed their new properties for only 30 days. That was a plus in having a broker who didn't pay attention to things.



well I have seen that two different weichert offices each have different commission structures - which leads me to believe that each brokerage is free to set up their own commission splits as long as weichert gets its 8% fee.

What an agent gets is between the agent and the broker - correct?

To earn $20,000 at your old brokerage you would have to do slightly over $1,111,111.11 then the next million in gross sales would net you another $19,500 at 65%.

That same $2,111,111.11 would net you $50,666.67 at one of the two 80% houses instead of $39,500.00. at a 50% you are looking at slightly less than $31,666.67.

At a 95% agency that is not as convenient (NOT the Slime ball RE/MAX) you would earn $60,166.67 minus "desk fees" Of What?

My first year I did over $3,000,000 in gross sales. I paid $12,000 in "desk fees". Grossed after "desk fees" $73,500 (which I still could not really survive after you take out advertising, mls board fees, gas, etc.)

Who cares if Weichert is making the other offices eat their dust How much do you keep in Your Pocket?

Perky_REALTOR,

I am sorry, we are putting pressure on you. I truly wish you all the luck in the world. I will help you if I can, by sending you training tapes, etc. You pick the agency that you feel is the best.

Do the Buffini thing and watch The Secret

I just hope you do not go to the wrong office simply to have "unplanned", casual, neighborly, and incidental human contact. If you go to Weichert then we would not be able to have casual, neighborly, and incidental human contact at the RE/MAX convention. Just Kidding Kristi

Cool Cat

P.S. Can you Dig?

Perky I would disregard this post. This is under the assumption you do the same number of transactions at each broker and nor does this calculate any increase on your split, it is assuming you're still at a 50/50 split.

I went from Broker A at 95% to Broker B at 70%. Today I make a lot more at B than I did at A. The reason is B gets more foot traffic in the door, calls etc and B handles more advertising, no desk fees etc than A which was less out of my pocket.

I'll take a 70% over a 95% any day if I am selling much more than I did at 95%. You can't always look at who has the better split, plain foolish. There are too many other factors to consider. You might start at 50%...but what can that turn into?

Did I miss something? Did Perky make her decision? Did she choose Weichert?

Perky Made Her Decision.

Perky did not go with the first Weichert office she interviewed at.

Perky went with a different Weichert office.

Perky is wound tighter than a long tailed cat in a room full of rocking chairs. Perky is hungry but the thought of food makes her ill. This has been a bipolar week for Perky.

Perky is going to sell a house tomorrow! And she may just take the kids to the movies tonight. Maybe even go to Red Robin too. Hungry Perky thinks maybe by tonight she'll be able to devour a big ol' 'Shroom Burger.
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forgive me. I am very tired. LOL

Is Perky getting a paycheck today?

I'd just like to clarify this for everyone. The majority of Weichert offices in New Jersey are company owned and operated. They are NOT franchised.

Outside of NJ, most offices are independently owned and operated, as you said Perky.

Just want to be clear that not every Weichert office is a franchised one.

Well Perky, I didn't know you had made a definite decision when I posted my comments. I would have posted differently had I known that.
I must say that Weichert and Exit were my final two choices and Exit got the nod because I was good friends with my sponsor and knew I'd get a lot of one on one time with her. If not for that I would have gone with Weichert too. So, good Luck!

YES!! And perky went to red robin and got her shroom burger and took the girls to see Ratatoulle (and hubby took the man-child to see transformers.

and perky has showings in the am and needs to go to sleep!

thanks everyone for all of your input and care. I really appreciate everyone's input.

undercoveragent, I did not know that the weicherts in jersey were corporate owned. I thought they were all franchises! very interesting indeed!

that's okay!!! I had thought about exit as well but the office was just further than I was willing to drive, and while I don't like to be chained to an office, I do like to go to the office a couple times a week and be "officey". At home I just schlump around if I'm not taking people out, etc...and end up watching Court Tv or something. LOL

Go to this post: Re: I'll take a 70% over a 95% any day

Do NOT disregard this post, if you are under the assumption that you can do more transactions at a different broker and increase your profit with a lower split. I am anxious to see if kep or anyone can give me some clarity on this subject and prove that I indeed do have "tunnel vision".

This has been an interesting discussion just because it shows us how different things are in different areas of the country.

Getting up and running in this area of the country seems to be particularly difficult. Competition has reduced commission rates to what seems like crumbs (a typical side for full service is well under 5%.) My average commission in one of the most expensive areas of the country is about $3000. I am recognizing that the offices around here (like Perky's area) are very stingy with the splits and this adds to the problem. When I first entered real estate (not that long ago) I interview several offices and they all had the SAME split unless I was willing to pay a large desk fee. 50:50 to start, then 60:40 after the brokerage has received anywhere between $30-50k. But it resets EVERY YEAR - apparently forever - to 50:50....although I imagine top producers can negotiate a deal. Worse still, you have to your part of the franchise fee - so you end up giving up between 56-58% of your side of the commission. For at least the first six months I seem to be pulling less than 1% on each transaction and I see no way to bring that up unless I open my own brokerage.

As soon as I have built a strong enough referal base, the only way out is to open my own brokerage and keep more. It's a lot of work, but the brokerages seem so bloody greedy and hungry for money that it is the only way for your hard work to pay off. Indeed, that is the current trend. One- man offices opening up all over the place. They are taking much larger pieces of the pie every year. The only thing that limits the practice is the fact that you have to have a fairly substantial transaction history in order to qualify for a brokers license. I would qualify now, but I feel that I'm not ready to make that move yet.

It seems like some areas of the country have better opportunities for agents to earn more per deal - and I think it makes a difference.

* The discussion of commissions and splits are for educational purposes only.

I'm jealous. I wish we had Red Robin in this area. They have some of the best hamburgers.

Congrats Perkey! I am glad you Hell week is over and hope that all works out Fine. I was never worried about you, you seem to be a smart intelligent person and can figure out whats best for Perky.

Im not a huge fan of Red Robin though. I do buy their seasoning mix though, Its great on grilled meats! Other than that, they can leave my area and I'd be OK with that.

Man... my split and brokerage are looking better all the time! I'll refrain from details but it's better than 75/25 and I have no desk fees nor any other kind of fees.

May I cast a vote for something similar to what I am doing. I am in a small brokerage, with 5 of us total. We have almost no advertising. We hustle our own business up. I have nearly 24/7 access to my broker whenever I need it for any reason. I have NO obligation for floor time; on the other hand, it'd be silly since we don't have floor traffic.

My split is amazing, I have my own office with a computer and phone line and internet, and reasonable use of the printer room. IE, I wouldn't abuse it by printing 200 color flyers or something but other than that, I hit Ctrl-P and print whatever I want.

If you truly want to be an independant contractor and not a psuedo-employee, it's something to think about!

-jeff

Hey how does this work? I can't see anyone talking but I know they are there doing something. I heard this was a good place to get theinfo on obtaining REO Listings. The most guarde secret in The RE Indusrty. Gotta figure out how to get a response form someone and I'll be off and running. Thanks

Uh... you need to go to the "forum" level of things (this is a thread in the Agents and Brokers forum). Do that by scrolling to the top of this page and look for the >>'s, and click "Agents and Brokers". Then, in the upper left, there will be a "new topic" button. That will start a new topic for you.

-jeff

Our office is small. Good agents are paid between 70-80%. No desk fees, no copy fees, no this fee or that fee. We have a broker/owner and an owner/sales asso. who are available 24/7. The agents mostly work from their home offices and they must keep the office informed on all deals.

As Jello put it "we hustle our own business", hence the high commission. All phone leads, sign leads, etc. are emailed to the agent who listed the property. The broker/owners never keep leads that come in from ads -- they are given out among the agents.

New agents and part-timers are paid either 50 or 60%.

You're at a Weichert office? And is it "corporate owned" or a "franchise?"

I really like my office so far. The owners are really great and seem to have a lot of positive energy.

That is where you top out at??? Yuck.

Most of our agents (f/t and p/t) have been with us for about 18 yrs. The agents are treated extremely well. I'm not going to go into all of the details here but I'd like to say one thing re your "yuck."

Who are you kidding? Considering your entire real estate "career" consists of 2 active listings (one of which was previously withdrawn twice) I'd say if you're being paid over 30% you should kiss your broker.