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#140983 - 05/15/07 09:03 PM
Re: Myers Internet - Warning to Brokers
[Re: realting]
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Member
Registered: 06/01/06
Posts: 310
Loc: california
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we are not employees and under any circumstance can obligate the company/broker financially. The original poster is a broker so he's speaking from the broker perspective. You are speaking from the agent perspective. Did your creditor take you to court? I don't have an answer for you but it would be interesting to see what a real judge says. You are mixing contractual obligations with agency obligations. What you and your broker have on contracts are between you and your broker. But when another party accuses you of a wrongdoing on the part of and as a representative of the broker that's a different issue. You have a contract with the STATE that your agent is your obligation. The real issue here is whether the judge will use civil contract law or agency law to hear this case. Under contract laws you are 100% that the agent is liable for his own debt. Under agency law, the broker is liabile for his agent actions when acting as agent for the broker. The agent signed the contract but the agent MOST LIKELY INCLUDED his broker company name on the contract too. Somebody call Judge Judy. P.S. the agent is never liabile for the broker's action. But the broker has a statutory obligation ( agency law ) to watch over his agents. We're talking about two different issues here. The last person we need is a goof like Judge Judy Scheindlein. I can't stand her. A judge will inquire as to whether the agent was authorized, either directly or ostensibly, to enter into a contract on behalf of the broker. In most cases, the answer will be NO. In financial disputes (excluding fraud), civil contract law will usually prevail.
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#141052 - 05/16/07 02:29 AM
Re: Myers Internet - Warning to Brokers
[Re: ericka]
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California Real Estate Broker
Veteran Member
Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 1225
Loc: Morgan Hill, CA, USA
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I am stunned that this discussion has gotten this far.
If what some seem to think is the case, all we ever have to do is simply WRITE the name of our company on a form and suddenly they are liable for our expenses.
A real estate agent is only our legally recognized agent for the purposes of real estate transactions. At least state law in California pretty clearly spells out what we are responsible for regarding our agents, and their debt is not one of them.
You cannot make a brokerage a party to your debt without the expressed consent of the brokerage - PERIOD.
Agency law has NOTHING to do with an agent incurring debt - whether that debt is brought about while conducting his duties or not. There is no agency relationship created between the one owed money and the agent owing it... it simply is not germane.
The ONLY way a broker can be held to account for his agents expenses is if they have signed an agreement to do so.
R
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#141056 - 05/16/07 04:57 AM
Re: Myers Internet - Warning to Brokers
[Re: RebelBroker]
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Major Contributor
Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 2050
Loc: The Middle of the Interstate
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And just to follow up, I finally got an answer from Myers yesterday that they made an "error" and they never should have turned it over for collection in the company name. They did have a home address, email and phone number for the agent involved.
Also, I "fired" the agent yesterday. We found an unopened envelope from Myers on his desk postmarked February which he never opened. I had him open it in my presence and it was a bill. He said he never opened it because he "assumed" it was an ad. We all know you never "assume" anything in real estate. Imagine the problem if this had been something involving a transaction or a buyer-seller dispute or anything else pertaining to real estate law or Realtor ethics.
As a broker, we assume some liability for the actions of the licensees in our office, but we should never assume any liability for stupidity or malfeasence.
_________________________
Broker-Owner Thirteen Years REO Experience
GRI,CRS,CRB,e-Pro
Some days I feel like the bug, other days I feel like the windshield
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#141286 - 05/16/07 09:50 PM
Re: Myers Internet - Warning to Brokers
[Re: PA Roadkill]
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Member
Registered: 06/01/06
Posts: 310
Loc: california
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And just to follow up, I finally got an answer from Myers yesterday that they made an "error" and they never should have turned it over for collection in the company name. They did have a home address, email and phone number for the agent involved.
Also, I "fired" the agent yesterday. We found an unopened envelope from Myers on his desk postmarked February which he never opened. I had him open it in my presence and it was a bill. He said he never opened it because he "assumed" it was an ad. We all know you never "assume" anything in real estate. Imagine the problem if this had been something involving a transaction or a buyer-seller dispute or anything else pertaining to real estate law or Realtor ethics.
As a broker, we assume some liability for the actions of the licensees in our office, but we should never assume any liability for stupidity or malfeasence.
Exactly. Be very careful not to ratify any improper actions by the agent after-the-fact.
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#141325 - 05/17/07 04:49 AM
Re: Myers Internet - Warning to Brokers
[Re: ericka]
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Major Contributor
Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 2050
Loc: The Middle of the Interstate
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I had a long conversation with Tracee from Myers yesterday as well as a few emails. They are trying to correct it and get me something in writing from their (bottom feeding) collection agency which so far will not return phone calls.
As far as the agent is concerned, this is the third time I have received of some kind of late notice, but the first two were for board dues and MLS fees. As the Broker of record, I would be responsible for these if they were not paid. This agent was here 9 months, never wrote a contract or listed a property and never completed the new agent training program (we have two different ways to accomplish this).
I'm sure the (bottom feeding) collection agency figured they could send a letter and somehow the company would just pay it without checking out the origin of the bill.
_________________________
Broker-Owner Thirteen Years REO Experience
GRI,CRS,CRB,e-Pro
Some days I feel like the bug, other days I feel like the windshield
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#141604 - 05/18/07 05:40 PM
Re: Myers Internet - Warning to Brokers
[Re: realting]
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Member
Registered: 04/09/07
Posts: 210
Loc: CA
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brokers are not responsible for debts created by agents who act outside the scope of their agency
unless their agreement says otherwise, agents are not authorized to create debts for their brokers
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#141683 - 05/19/07 04:52 AM
Re: Myers Internet - Warning to Brokers
[Re: Chris]
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Major Contributor
Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 2050
Loc: The Middle of the Interstate
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Hopefully my last post here on this.
The collection agency called Thursday morning to see what I needed to end this.
I mentioned the fair credit collection laws and the fact that they violated the laws.
They were supposed to fax me something, but I've been at NAR Midyear since Thursday morning, so I'll find out if they did on Monday morning.
_________________________
Broker-Owner Thirteen Years REO Experience
GRI,CRS,CRB,e-Pro
Some days I feel like the bug, other days I feel like the windshield
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#166689 - 08/30/07 12:16 AM
Re: Myers Internet - Warning to Brokers
[Re: realting]
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Member
Registered: 08/29/07
Posts: 30
Loc: Maryland, USA
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Incorrect---CBS got fined for putting the wardrobe malfunction on the Air which was their responsibility. There is always a slight delay in airing even on live shows and it could have been edited! But, as to the issue of liability, we are brokers not lawyers and the independent contractor agreement should be specific as to the financial liability when the affiliation "broker name" is used by sales associates. The clauses are drafted for risk reduction/management and prevention. Even if there is no legal basis--we have to avoid any risk, possible disputes, claims and complaints.
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