My wife and I just passed our state exams and we are trying to decide which brokerage to go with. We have meet with C21 & Coldwell Banker so far, leaning toward CW at this point. We have one last meeting this week before we make our final decision and it's with Keller Williams. I did a search on here and not a lot of info really came back. It did say KW is starting at 70/30 while everyone else is 50/50. One thing I've learned in my time in this world is that no gives up something for nothing, so why is KW offering so much more to start? Are there other areas were they aren't up to the standards of the other companies?

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,
Will Rose

The best advise I would offer to any new agent is find out what their training program consist of and whether or not they charge you for the training. The more knowledge you have the more powerful you will be. Ask what is offered for the fee they receive from you,(ads,lockboxes,signs,flyer boxes,office support) you get the picture. Check out Weichert Realtors if you have one in your area they have a fantastic training program. Good Luck to you.

You should also check out Prudential in your area. I have found that Prudential has some great training. C21 also has great training too. If you have questions about Keller Williams, I am sure that "Keller Williams Agent" forum member will be glad to answer and refer you to them. Could be a little bias though.

Shop around, i checked out quite a few brokers and Tarbell fit my needs with a 65/35 starting split and awesome training. Not sure if it will fit your needs, but shop around before making a decision.

Also make sure you talk to multiple brokers even if they represent the same names. Each broker can/will set their own rules and compensations. i am with C21 and get to keep about 90% of my commission. I know another agent with another c21 office and his split is 50/50.

Agent007,
We're all biased towards our own companies, otherwise we wouldn't have chosen to work where we do.

FL Will,
I work at Keller Williams and I will try to shed some light on KW's commission structure. KW's starting split wasn't always 70/30 - it used to be 50/50. Back when KW was a small agency in Texas, Remax came to town and many of the KW agents jumped ship for Remax's 100% commission structure.

To keep the remaining agents, one of the changes the founder of KW made was to the the pay structure - from 50/50 to 70/30 to start & then 100% after a certain production goal. It wasn't done as a gimmick, but rather out of survival. The trade off is there's a $100/mo "desk fee."

Regarding your question of wondering if KW isn't up to standard in other areas, I believe we hold our own against anyone. However, I'm sure some of the other agents from other companies will be happy to chime in though...

I encourage you to interview at as many companies as you can. And even then, if you decide on one place and then aren't happy, you can always go to work for another agency. That's part of the beauty of real estate, the job interviewing process is easier than any other industry! :0) As a new agent, training should be your #1 priority (KW has great training by the way). Best of luck in your decision, and much success!

Thanks for the info. I haven't spoke to anyone at Remax, do they really start you at 100%? How does that deal work?

From what I have heard, Remax is a company for experienced agents, not new agents. There are a few franchises here that have no training whatsoever, so it would be hard to start there as a new agent.

Agent007 is right, Remax is probably not the place for a new agent. Remax in my area also offers little if no training, and with the 100% commission comes a hefty monthly desk fee...upwards of $1000/mo (from what I've heard). You have to be ready to produce - and as a new agent, it could take 6 months before you close your first deal...

Remember, a 100% commission at Re/Max may not be as good as it sounds. A Remax broker was recruiting me not to long ago, and after all the office fees and royalty fees, it worked out to be closer to 75/25.

Does Keller Williams offer any type of group health insurance (I know we would have to pay for it but I was just wondering if they offer anything like that)?

Very Unhappy when I was with Keller Williams. I think if you figure it out, you get 64% until you cap out. I don't know what the cap is in your area. That is before you even spend a dollar on marketing, advertising, etc..

When I hear Keller Williams I Run the other way. Here's why..

1. I have been in real estate for over 20 years. So I am experienced. I am also what you'd call a high profile agent. I was with Keller Williams for the past 2 years until I got fed up and left. I got tired of changing rules on a monthly basis, lousy sub-standard training (I did some training myself too, LOL, and generally getting nickeled and dimed to death. The 70% thing is crap, after you factor in cost of signs, advertising, desk fees, photocopy paper, shared expenses, NO NATIONAL ADVERTISING!, etc, etc, well, you get the picture.. Then you may also need an assistant because they don't even give you any admin support. After two years of this crap, I ran outta there and went back to Coldwell Banker. All this aggravation? I'd rather open up my own.
The Profit share was a joke. I was the second best recruiter in the office and I made on average about $900 the second year. I could've made more selling one more house. A good amount of my "downline" left anyway, so I didn't lose anything. I am just So sore on KW. I went to the "Family Reunion" last year and I was very unimpressed with everything, I think I made my final decision after I went there. (Family Reunion is the KW annual Convention)..

I'm with an independant Broker, two locations in the DFW, with about 600 agents. The Michael Group offers 100% to it's agents, they give FREE training twice a week, include MCE classes. However, you need to understand that the big name brokers have advertising and franchise fees that are extended to the agent and they generally have a broker split on commissions. If you're new to the business and lack knowledge and confidence, it maybe more advantageous to go with a big name brokers. Good Luck!

Hey FL Will, I don't think that Keller Williams or any other Broker, including my Broker offers any type of health coverage, except to it's office staff. As a Realtor, we're independent contractors and are responsible for our own Healthcare. However if you're interested in some Healthcare for you or your family, send me a private email.

Straight Shooter,
It's real easy to be critical when you're hiding behind a screen name. But I guess as a "high profile agent" you're hiding from the paparazzi...I understand.

First of all, what "changing rules" are you talking about?

Regarding KWs training, I spent almost 7 years working for one of the largest investment companies in the world and they were well-known for excellent training, and KW's training (scope and frequency) was just as good. You make light of the fact that you taught some classes....well, what you fail to realize is that many new agents benefit from the wisdom of being taught by experienced agents.

Regarding the 70% commission, the 6% royalty does not cap when you hit the 100% commission mark. I don't know what the # in Mass is (maybe it's the same), but in Bryn Mawr, PA it caps at $3000. My average SP is $315k, so after 5.23 deals, and I'm done until it starts up again on the anniv. of my hire date. Since you want to sling mud, when I interviewed at CB, I was told my starting split would be 50/50, with a 6% royalty - which meant my net commission would be 44%. And on top of that, the royalty would always be there.

Profit sharing is not a joke. Here's what the top 10 profit sharing agents at KW have made this year YTD, as at 10/10/06 in profit sharing:
1. $331,847.26
2. $308,038.42
3. $260,794.03
4. $260,276.46
5. $247,881.50
6. $213,203.81
7. $212,529.73
8. $205,999.53
9. $185,846.94
10. $185,247.70

Will every KW agent get rich on profit sharing? Of course not, but it takes longer than 2 years to benefit from it. If anything, it's nice to have some supplemental income. Also, as most agents fail in real estate, you're always going to have agents fall out of your down line. But I'm sure all the agents you recruited are all successful and decided to move on to another agency.

Argghhhh....you know what, I can't even go on responding to you. All I can say is best wishes, Straight Shooter, whomever you are!

FL Will,
No, health coverage is not provided, as is common in the RE industry.

Damon,
Newsflash for you but since you have never worked for Coldwell Banker any mud you would be slinging would be uneducated mud since you have Zero personal experience to comment on in regards to Coldwell Banker. That said each
Coldwell Banker office differs greatly as do KW offices. Individual brokers do things differently and training differs as well and if you say differently then you are a fool.

So what kind of National Advertising does KW do???? The answer to that question is None!

CB does tons of National Advertising which does benefit local awareness. That is in part where that 6% franchise fee goes and what it pays for.

Regarding profit sharing here is a question. What did the lower 95% of agents make from profit sharing?

If an agent needs supplemental income I would definately suggest investment property as opposed to KW profit sharing.

Agents should concentrate on listing and selling property and leave the recruiting to the brokers whose job it is to recruit.

From KW's website:

Annual profit share: $52,929,952

# of active agents: 70444

$52,929,952/70444=$751.38. So, on average, KW's agents make less than $800 per year in profit sharing.

In Atlanta, KW's cap is $18,000. My company's cap is either $10k or $8k (depending on your specific setup). So, you spend an extra $8000 to make an average of $751!

With that being said, I think KW's model (aside from the profit sharing) is great! From what I've seen, they really go overboard on the quality of their image as well as their corporate training programs.

Bottom line- if you choose KW because of the profit sharing plan (as many do), you will be sorely disappointed. If you choose KW (or anyone else) because you think it matches your personality and would give you the best chance to become successful, you will have made a wise choice.

Newsflash to you Paul...I'm using CB simply to point out that they have a royalty fee, as well.

You can debate the use of the royalty fee all you want, but a new licensee reading Straight Shooters comments could have easily misinterpreted them to mean KW charges a fee when perhaps the others dont. I'm simply pointing out that CB does as well.

Regarding advertising, the traditional channels of tv and newspaper, are not the only ways to create brand awareness. Also, it's widely known that newspaper ads are a huge expense and give little in return. I'm sure being a broker you already know this truth. The sentiment among the agencies in my area is that they know it gives little in return, but they feel like they need to run them to keep their listing clients happy.

Also, you might have heard of a small little rinkey-dink investment company called The Vanguard Group - guess how much traditional advertising they do? Dollar for dollar, next to nothing compared to the other big investment companies.

Regarding your profit sharing question of what do the bottom 95% make, that's easy....probably very little. I'm sure the 80/20 rule applies to to PS just like everything else. Again, Straight Shooter was saying it's a joke, but I'm simply pointing out that you can make money. It probably won't be in the top ten, but you can definitely make money.

Regarding recruiting, most KW agents (including myself) spend very little time on it. If I see an opportunity where someone might be considering making a move or they're new and have questions, then I'll mention something to them. And if they want to move forward with an interview, I simply give their name to my boss and she takes over from there. Painless for me and takes zero time. Still leaves plenty of time to invest in real estate.

Paul, no need to get in a huff when a company has a business model that goes against your high almighty way. But if you can't see there's more then one path/business model to success, then you are the fool.

Semper ubi sub ubi,
Damon

[/QB][/QUOTE]

That's a really bad way to look at it, unless your plan is to merely be average. And if you're content with being average .... my condolances. As we all know the average agent is a failure.

If I was going to recruit (even though I'm with KW I don't recruit at all), I'd be looking at the upside and not the average. Just like it's maybe 1 out of 100 agents who make a good living, it's probably 1 out of 100 KW agents who will make good money at recruiting.

I'm at Keller Williams and it suits my needs. I can really see where some people wouldn't like it, I have had to learn to overlook all of the cheerleading and "we're a family" stuff that they promote because frankly that's not me.

If I was a new agent again I think I would feel really "welcome" at KW and I know our office has great education. It's a positive atmosphere, sometimes to the point of annoyance (at least for me).

Damon,
You are the one that pointed out that the royality fee is always present. Since it normally comes off the top it is actually split between the brokerage and the agent. Not all do it this way but many do so again that just proves my point that most offices are run different with their procedures and training. I wanted the new agents to know what that royalty fee does for them. Those national tv & radio spots cost money but generate brand awareness which translates into clients and drives traffic to the national websites and from there to the individual offices.

Print ads give little return and are done mostly for the clients who feel that their home should be in the sunday paper or the homes guide. The homes guide publications actually shows some return and is an excellent means of promoting your website to drive traffic to you. TV & Radio spots do a much better job of return on investment of ad dollars. For brand awareness the majority of people in the country know what Coldwell Banker does while in many places Keller & Williams might be confused with a law firm or accountants.

As for brand awareness Anheuser-Busch spends more ad dollars that any other brewer. Guess what? Everyone knows that Budweiser is the King of Beers! You may not drink it but when someone says King of Beers you know exactly what they are talking about!

Nearly EVERY new KW & Exit agent that posts here hits it hard and heavy with the recruitment attempts and the thing they always bring up first is the potential residual income that can be made with their profit sharing. That should be the very Last thing even considered when joining a brokerage.

Damon if you really think that I am getting ina "huff" over KW's business model then it is you that is the fool. I was just correcting the perception you made about royalty fees and what that royalty fee really does for you! Yes there are many paths to sucess but if recruiting is your primary path then open your own brokerage!


Monstra mihi pecuniam!

You are absolutely correct. The average AGENT tends to fail. This statistic, however, is focused on the bonus plan and therefore, recruiting. So, the average RECRUITER doesn't do so well.

JFlynn, you are proof that someone can be an excellent agent without recruiting.

Unfortunately with this model, a lot of agents succumb to the idea of recruiting and end up focusing on this a lot more than they should.

The point of my original post was that some KW associates push the recruiting aspect so much that they convince new associates that it is a lot more lucrative than it actually is.

Also, there is an opportunity cost involved with the model incorporating a recruiting function. By paying more in desk fees/commission splits, agents are given an opportunity to make some extra money (avg: $751/yr). If I was a KW agent, I wouldn't make a dime in bonuses, because I would not focus on recruiting.

I believe that if you took the recruiting part away from KW (along with the cost of recruiting/bonuses), the model would be almost as successful (if not more) than it is now. This speaks volumes about the way the corporation is set up, as well as the dedication and professionalism I have witnessed when meeting a few of the franchisees.

Paul,
Of course, a company like A-B can create brand awareness by spending millions on ads. My Vanguard example was again to illustrate there's more than one way to create brand awareness...and Vanguard does a great job of it without spending the big dollars. What's interesting is - I probably see Bud commercials a few times a week & hear the radio ads the same amount, conversely, rarely have I seen tv spots for CB (or any other other agency for that matter), and have never heard a radio spot for any agency in my local market. All that royalty $$ is going somewhere, just not to the local Philadelphia-metro area where I live.

I'm burned out on this topic Paul, at least tell me what "Monstra mihi pecuniam" means and what language it is...

It is Latin,
It means Show Me The Money!

Very nice. Mine was a little less Donald Trump-esque...Semper ubi sub ubi..."always where under wear!" Technically, it's incorrect usage of the 2nd ubi but i don't know the word for underwear in latin. On that note...Pax Romana!

What in heaven's name am I getting for my money at Keller Williams? You tell me..

When I left, to cap it was $21,000 and the 6% royalty fee for $3,000..

Don't forget, you can only get vested fro life after 3 years, When I first went there, I was told it was 2 years.. I couldn't even wait THAT long...!They couldn't believe I was leaving.. I felt like I was in a religious cult the way some of them were acting.. (Maybe that's why I'm 'hiding' behind a screen name, LOL)I had enough.. Soon after I left, the office went from an agent count of 109 down to around 72.. Some of this was due to the market slowdown, but there were other reasons too.. I could go on and on and on but I didn't come here for this. I came here to give advice to a new agent. I did it, and I'm done!

You made a good choice by choosing kw.

That is yet to be seen.

You seem to be forgetting something very important. All KW offices are run differently as they have different broker\owners and different procedures and the same holds true for every franchise. That is why I and your experienced fellow KW agents have said it is important that new agents really interview their prospective brokers and take into account all aspects of the operation.

Making blanket statements that KW or CB or Joe's Realty is the best is really not accurate.

I said that to get a response from you because I knew you would respond because I like ya. Actually Paul, I have been in Real Estate for only 1 year and have completed 4 deals in my 1st year. Along the way I recruited a mega producing agent from C21 Town and Country in Michigan, I will recieve a profit sharing check at the end of this month and let you know how much it came out to. I hope things are going well for you in your business at Coldwell Banker.

I don't know how many deals I closed in my first year but it was maybe 15-20 totalling about $7M in sales. I didn't recruit a single agent so I didn't get any profit sharing checks, but my net prifit was over a hundred grand at the end of the year.

I'm also a KW agent but you won't see me recruiting here. It seems to me the better money is in doing deals compared to recruiting.

I don't know where you are located but in Georgia there is an independent company called Solid Source which offers Health Insurance. They are a large company that has a monthly fee and then a transaction fee. They are somewhat of a virtual broker. I don't know what kind of training and ect. they offer. I know they are looking into expanding into other states. Your state might be included.

KW profit sharing is mostly a big joke. That I learned by talking to several successful agents who left the company. Their commission split is also crap. Many smaller brokers will pay you 70/30 and move up to as high as 90/10 over time. Finally, in many cases help is nonexistent, since unless you join a small team, there will only be one or two brokers for every 100 agents.

I don't know about their training, but it costs you $400 to take it, and then they charge you desk fees. My broker does this for free on a need-to-know basis. I call him in the middle of the night if I have an urgent deal going down.

Lastly, KW smacks of a multi level marketing scheme. Too much emphasis on recruiting, to the point where they have every other agent in town, doing one deal a year. Then they like to use this to point out how much business they do. I actually saw statistics somewhere that out of all big brokers, KW agents are the least productive.

Well, in my experience, KW is great. Noone else in my area offers a cap, so that in itself is one excellent reason to choose KW here. Most places here start you at 50/50 or have very high office fees and don't offer a cap. KW is a win in that regard here in my town.

The training at my office is tops in the area as well, judging by my past experience at the local Century 21 and from talking to other agents. We have up to 4 classes a day, as opposed to two a week at the local C21. Nor does it 'cost $400'. Not sure what kind of training you can call your broker to get in the middle of the night If you mean having a Broker that is willing to help, my office has not only a noncompeting Broker, but a Transaction Coordinator, Listing Coordinator and a Director of Compliance

The profit sharing is another bonus. The local Century 21 pushed recruiting but offered absolutely nothing for it. He actually told us he expected us to bring in new agents as a favor to him.

So, like has been said time and time again, your mileage may vary. Take everything here, especially the ones quoting statistics that they won't share and those making accusations when in the same sentence they say they 'don't know about' what they are making accusations of and realize that you really, really need to ask around locally.

Asking anyone here which franchise is the best in your area is like calling Japan to ask how the weather is outside your door.

ScoFla, when I interviewed with KW, they told me I'd be forced to take their introductory class on contracts and some other BS, and for this I had to pay $400. And their class only happened 4 hours a week, so I'd be force to wait 6 weeks to finish it until I could do anything. And, on top of that, I got charged a monthly fee for desk, voice mail and email, which I would never use.

Maybe it's that way here in San Antonion, but we are supposed to be the birthplace of KW. For some reason I hear a lot of bitching from their agents who leave them in droves. We have many wonderful smaller brokers who pay good splits (70/30 is pretty much a minimum) and offer personal assistance.

And that just proves the point that every office can be different. That's completely opposite of my experience with KW but knowing that I can't possibly speak for every single KW office, I don't make grand sweeping statements.

You left out the part where KW "caps" every year and afterwards you're on a 100% commission plan. I capped both years I've been with the company putting me on a 100% commission plan.

How much did you sell last year?

Caps? With my broker I moved up to 90/10 and I stay there FOR LIFE. With KW, my cap gets reset every year. And the caps I've been quoted by local KW are only good for top producers. Hardly useful for new agents. Several small brokers I know move you up to 90/10 or (85/15) after $40k in commissions. Not bad...doable in one year.

I also know of a broker that caps out at $15k commission once a year, all the while having the 90/10 split. Some offices just have very low overhead. I don't need a large KW office since I'm never there, so why should I pay for it? I also don't need to pay for their continuing advertising and recruiting efforts. They provide me with zero leads for that money, while many smaller brokers who have a lot of business will give leads to you for a referral fee of about 20%-30%.

This profit sharing is no joke, those agents just never recruited anybody. At my office in Northville, Mi. I get 70/30. Profit Sharing monthly because I recruired a mega producer from C21 Town & Country whenI receieve my check Ill let u all know how much I recievec. Pay 6% franchise fee and $90/montly in operating expenses and free 24/7 training. KW makes my life as a realtor very easy and am thankful to be a part of it. I don't know if San Antonio is close to Dallas but consider as a 2nd option Dallas Preston Road because they have over 600 agents and is one of the highest profitable offices in North America if things don't go well with the compnay you are at. The Dallas Preston Road broker makes more than $10,000 in profit sharing every month.

I capped last year at KW as a brand new agent and I capped again this year. Mybe you just need to set your goals higher? There's no reason you can't be a top producer yourself.

What you're not telling this guy is that you're recommending that office to him because you'll make more money if he goes there. The more profitable an office, the more you make if you send a recruit there.

BTW San Antonio is about a 5 hour drive from that office, a fact you could have learned in about 30 seconds on mapquest.com.

Go sell some houses instead of wasting your time on recruiting.

Thanks for all the replies. My wife and I meet with KW and did not like the vibe we got at all. It seemed almost cult like with all the family stuff. Mention it once or twice and it seems nice, mention it 50-60 times and it gets weird. Also, the "profit sharing" thing just seemed like a pyramid scheme to us. We have decided to go with Coldwell Banker. They seemed to be a more stable company and it feels like we are getting something for the money we split with them.

Thanks again for all the thoughts.

Best regards,
Will Rose

Hey, Will, where in Fla are you?

Best of luck at Coldwell, what do they offer?

And the profit sharing thing should be looked at as a bonus, not a way to make a living. But if it was preached upon at my office, it would have made me run for the door as well.

Congratulations.. I sincerely wish you the best. I only wish I saw the situation the way you just described your situation; it would have saved me two years of wasted time on my part. I also felt they were very "cultish"; you should have seen their reaction when I "left the flock".. LOL.. Focus on being a serious real estate professional and learn everything you can, be proud of who you are, what you do, what you offer, and with whom you associate. You'll do excellent!

1. Let me ask you all something, for all those who work at other compnaies other than KW how much profit sharing did you receive at the end of every month ?

2. Do the company that you are working at share their profits among their agents if they do profit, if not, ask your broker why?

3. Would anyone want to explain to me why Keller Williams is the fastest growing company in North America?

4. Does your company offer free traning?

5. For those who claim the profit sharing to be a joke and claim it to be a pyramid, have you ever worked at KW b4?

This post started from a couple who started at KW because of 70/30 and profit sharing and they were voicing their honest opinion. For all those in here from other compnaies aside KW who bad mouth other companies, is it true that these brokers teaches their agents to put down the competition because if it does I would never consider them as a 2nd option. Oh and let's say for example if you work for a company and want to switch KW will let you take your listings with you unlike other compnaies.

I'll take a stab at these questions:

**
1. Let me ask you all something, for all those who work at other compnaies other than KW how much profit sharing did you receive at the end of every month ?
**

None for me, but I'm on a 90/10 split and every $20k a year I bring into the company, it's 100% afterwards. I also pay no running fees, and have a very supportive broker (and other experienced agents) who are willing to help.

Again, stop with the f**ing profit sharing. It's annoying already.

**
2. Do the company that you are working at share their profits among their agents if they do profit, if not, ask your broker why?
**

Already answered, again, shut the f*** up about profit sharing. Is that all that's great about KW?

**
3. Would anyone want to explain to me why Keller Williams is the fastest growing company in North America?
**

I know, they are a friggin cult and multi-level marketing scheme. Almost every KW realtor you run into sings praises about them and tries to recruit you. One bored housewife/part time agent recruits all her 10 other bored housewife friends and there you have it. They each do one deal a year, KW is happy, the housewives yap about how they're part of the family. It's kind of like those multi-level insurance scams where you sell to your friends and family and try to recruit them as well.


**
4. Does your company offer free traning?
**

Yes, if I have a question I ask my broker, and he always answers. According to some ppl I talked to, at KW you'd be lucky to get a hold of anyone. They force you to take an intro class and charge you for it. What kind of training do you want anyway? So many agents just train and train, and never do anything productive. If I want to know the ins and outs of buying undeveloped land, will KW have a class about that, and everything that can go wrong? My broker once sat down with me and explained how to do such a deal. Took only 20 minutes.

**
5. For those who claim the profit sharing to be a joke and claim it to be a pyramid, have you ever worked at KW b4?
**

Classic "you haven't done it so don't say" arguemnt. I don't need to learn on my own mistakes when I know several people I respect who've been there, done it, and didn't like it.

KW doesn't offer anything extra that other brokers don't give you, and profit sharing IS a joke, unless you're there long enough and recruit a ton of people.


Jeez, these KW agents are just as annoying as Exit.

Patrick,
1. I do not depend on others profitability instead I trust to my resources including my stock account, investment properties, Roth IRA and a SEP. Now those are profit sharing I can depend on!

2.Why should I expect the company where I hang my license to share their profits with me? I am my own business and they charge me a fair fee for the services they provide including any training(my company pays for a CCIM class each year. You think residential designations are expensive try looking at commercial designations), Support staff including a brokerage coordinator, IT staff, Misc admin personel, a closing coordinator, signage, national advertising, local name recognition and the list goes on.

3.KW has no where to go but up as they are in far fewer markets than CB, C21, ERA, ReMax, Realty Executives.

4. No company offers truely free training as it is paid for via your split. Any time a company says he this is free you should look at it as being paid for by you so take advantage of it!

5. Never worked at KW but I do know others that do.

Other companies do not teach their agents to recruit, recruit, recruit. They instead focus on Sell, Sell, Sell after all you are in the business of selling real estate and that is what makes you profitable. If you want to recruit then become a head hunter! Funny but the seasoned KW agents do not try recruiting on here but all the new agents did so automatically so it must be something in the training(Jason is the exception to that rule as he never tried to recruit anyone)

The ability to take your listing with you is spelled out in your IC agreement. In mine it says my listing are mine should I leave oweing only current expenses of the listing. Was not aware of KW having a blanket policy that says when you leave you get to take all your listings to your new company for free. Maybe some other KW agents can weight-in on this point.

ronsmith,
Now Calm down, Step back and take 10 deep breaths! Center yourself!

Just post the facts without all the ** comments it makes you look less professional.

I would also like to chime in on this one.

1. My company (Prudential) does have a system where if I refer someone to the company, I will make 5% of whatever the company's split is off of that agent for the first year. 2.5% every year after.

2. Yes, my company shares its profits. Read above statement.

3. Fastest growing? Who cares! How about being with one of the "already" largest (grown) companies in the world? ex. Century 21, Pruential, Remax...

4. Free training? Yup!

5. For those that claim it to be a pyramid scheme? That's exactly what it is! There is no way around it.

For companies to allow you to take your listings, it would all depend on the agent and their franchise. Enough said.

I too, am getting tired of you.. and like Ronsmith, I am going to try and take a "stab" at your points.. I find it insulting how you "assume" some things.. Unlike RonSmith, I was a Coldwell Banker Agent for about 8 years. I went to Keller Williams in 2004 with the mind set of profit sharing, and I recruited a mega producer, 5 other agents, ALL Producers.. I was well within recruiting 2 more well known producers (not from Coldwell Banker), before I got fed up and left. So I speak with the voice of experience... You can "sing" all you want, but at least you can't say I should try it, because I did! And I did very well, too, mind you, but I guess you wouldn't see it that way, because I would have to assume that, for you, success is only achieved if you are a Keller WIlliams Agent. I find that line of thinking very "cultish"..Let's look at yor "points"...

1. Let me ask you all something, for all those who work at other compnaies other than KW how much profit sharing did you receive at the end of every month ?

My response.. Who cares? You know WHY the office makes profit? They don't have the expenses the other companies have, that's why? No advertising.. The agents pay for everything. They get the caps and basically pay the "Team Leader" or another term for "glorified manager", and the receptionists, in most cases, part time. The MCA gets paid too.. Then you have the rent and utilities. If the office has a ful house, and charge the desk fees and everything, there is profit. If you don't have anyone on your downline , no profit. Let me say something about the recruiting, and remember, I was good at this and I wasn't even trying.. It's easy to recruit agents who don't sell much at Keller Williams if they don't run up expenses and don't rent space. They can "vegetate" all they want, and sell a couple of houses a year. If they don't even advertise, they may actually make more... That's fine by me...

2. Do the company that you are working at share their profits among their agents if they do profit, if not, ask your broker why?

How much profit are we talking about? I didn't leave KW because the profit was lousy, but at a maximum, if I sold a couple of extra homes per year, it would more than make up for all the aggravation one has to spend "coddling" and "kissing up" to their downline.. One condo under $100k was more money for me than any Downline money I made, and that's NOT the reason I left.

3. Would anyone want to explain to me why Keller Williams is the fastest growing company in North America?

Let's see if we can find out how many agents LEAVE every year too.. and fastest growing, I heard Exit make that same claim too.. They've brainwashed you, my friend..

4. Does your company offer free training?

Yes.. They have a monthly schedule of realistic, serious training that is not a copy of Brian Buffini, Roger Butcher, and Mike Ferry (4-4-3, which incidentally, the KW agents pay for materials.. ) They also have trainers, not agents who volunteer and lose time and get all stressed out on the idea they have to do all this free work to build up the office so some day they will find "Nirvana".. If I want that, I can join a real cult and sell flowers on street corners LOL..


5. For those who claim the profit sharing to be a joke and claim it to be a pyramid, have you ever worked at KW b4?

Oh yeah!

This post started from a couple who started at KW because of 70/30 and profit sharing and they were voicing their honest opinion. For all those in here from other companies aside KW who bad mouth other companies, is it true that these brokers teaches their agents to put down the competition because if it does I would never consider them as a 2nd option.

I can safely tell you my manager doesn't waste his time "teaching" us to put KW down.. I am not too, I am being vvery honest with my feelings and thoughts, and I don't want to see someone else "fall" for the crap..

Oh and let's say for example if you work for a company and want to switch KW will let you take your listings with you unlike other companies.

That depends on the clients and the broker... That's a small thing to concern yourself with.. You know that.. The company pays for Leadrouter, ALl my listings are enhanced at Realtor.com.. etc, etc..

Sorry to be so rough, but I also found out that KW agents can't take their own medicine! They can go around trying to recruit, but IF you try to tell them another point of view, they freak out and probably feel threatened..

Hey, thanks for the info on your companies.

Ron, your company sounds very nice, but you ought to se if they offer anger management classes

I didn't know Prudential offered that. But Len, isn't your recruiting bonus also a multilevel scheme?

Again, I think it is just a bonus if you bring someone in and think it's a great idea for any company to offer but I don't consider it a MLM.

And Paul is right, people ought to be Selling, not recruiting. And here on this board, we ought to be concerned with discussing real estate, not recruiting

"This post started from a couple who started at KW because of 70/30 and profit sharing and they were voicing their honest opinion."

Actually, I started this thread and my wife and I haven't started with KW, we were asking opinions on KW before we meet with someone from there. Actually, we didn't like KW at all and decided to go with Coldwell Banker.

At the end of the day opinions are opinions and hard to prove in an argument. Everyone views things differently. What I see as creepy cultish actions others see as warm and inviting. What I think is a pyramid scheme, someone else sees as a wonderful business opportunity. Bottom line is we all have our opinions and we get to voice them in this country (isn't America great!!!). So let's try and be nice to each other even if we disagree.

Thanks again to everyone who gave an opinion in this matter.

ScoFla,
I'm in St.Augustine, how about you?

Best Regards,
Will Rose

Tallahassee, lived in St. Augustine for a while in my younger days. Neat town, bet it's changed a lot since I was there.

Good luck with Coldwell Banker! I'm not naive to think that KW is the absolute only and best choice eveyrwhere.

ScoFla"- "I'm not naive to think that KW is the absolute only and best choice everywhere."

Sadly, I once was... LOL..

Okay, okay everyone, the cat's out of the bag...I have a confession to make...Keller Williams is actually a secret society founded by the descendents of The Knights Templar. AMDG.

Isn't it against the Realtor code of ethics to badmouth other companies?

Haha, anger management. I'm not angry. I honestly couldn't care less. Whatever company works for you that's fine by me.

I don't like the attitude many KW agents have, and how they are agressively recruiting and always claiming their company is better than everyone else, and does more business than everyone else, etc. They also aren't the most lucrative broker, as far as what you get for your money.

The people I really can't stand are Exit agents. Every conversation with them always goes into the "...so...have you thought about switching brokers" direction. It's just annoying.

Thankfully, Ron, I don't see that in my area. I do think my company is the best...but doesn't every Agent? Or they wouldn't be there or would have definite plans for leaving.

But again, you nor I can make broad blanket statements because neither one of us have the experience of working for every company. So, your statement 'aren't them most lucrative broker' probably isn't true nationwide.

Knights Templar? I thought it was Amway.

Those questions I posed were based only on previous bad comments made about KW, nothing more. This post had recieved more than 60 replies its got to be somekind of record considering this post is called "Keller Williams". I respect your guys opinions whether bad or good.

But all I got to say is WOW about KW profit sharing, im joking. This chat is a way for all real estate companies coming together as one. From my experience I know an agent who joined C21 because the color of their for sale sign is yellow/black, i know a lady agent who joined coldwell banker because she likes the color of the Coldwell Banker for sale sign is blue. I joined KW because of profit sharing and I love the KW red for sale sign. I AM KIDDING PEOPLE.

All in all seriously I hope you all do well in your biz. KW does not put their primary focus on recruiting, it puts it on sales and thats why we are growing every year and we are an open book company so any realtor can view kw's growth. I read all the replies to my questions which were anwsered fairly for the most part.

By the way considering I am from Michigan let's all jump on the Detroit Tigers bandwagon because the baseball teams in any other state sucks. Only the Tigers have a great baseball team and if you dump your favorite baseball team and join the Tiger bandwagon you will be considered winners because the Tigers are winning the World Series.

To be fair not every KW office pushes recruiting. In fact mine almost never mentions it, focusing instead on sales ... and we have some extremely successful agents at my office which is part of why I chose this office. I joined because my particular office's compensation plan, image, location, and broker made the best sense to my personal business plan at the time.

Each office is different, some very much so, so please don't lump all of us together. I assure all of you there is NO ONE at my office like the person in this thread. Please don't generalize, or think for a moment that he speaks for the whole company - he does not.

KW is not the greatest thing since sliced bread, but it is a good company in general and that has nothing to do with the profit sharing. In fact I wish they didn't have the profit sharing because so many agents and outsiders get wrapped up in talking about it that they forget to focus on the important issues about the brokerage.

Yes, if we were talking to consumers, not when we're talking to other agents. Plus it would be bad to badmouth other agents, not badmouth companies. Badmouthing a company to another agent is just giving your honest opinion to another professional, which is fine.

I am so glad I read all this. I've been selling for 10 years and just found out my office is closing. I was with CB for many years and then another large company in our area. I've considered KW, until I read these posts! It sounds like Amway, and I have no desire to be apart of any organization like that. And I almost feel sorry for "Keller Williams agent". It sounds like you have stars in your eyes, since you have had all of 4 deals in your career, and then recruited the heavy hitter. Sounds like you are sitting back waiting for that profit sharing check. My word of advice is don't count on anyone else to make you successful.

It's really not, but you should make that determination on your own in person. A lot of companies pay recruiting bonuses these days.

Well, I took it more from the "overzealous" approach and Cultlike attitude...
I was there.. That's what I felt..

Telula,
If you let your decisions be influenced by what you read on the internet...then I have a bridge to sell you.

Know the motivations of everyone that writes what they write. I say positive things about KW because I like it. Straight Shooter says negatives things because he worked there for a few years, felt like he was lied to and misled and now is bitter about it. Other agents who've never worked there, yet "hear" what it's like, well they feel the need to chime in as well.

Just like the political ads that have been running 24/7, the truth usually lies somewhere in the middle. And I sure hope you don't vote for your politicians based on watching those ads.

Come on, Damon...YOU sound like a politician...LOL..

Quote from Damon: "Straight Shooter says negatives things because he worked there for a few years, felt like he was lied to and misled and now is bitter about it."

What more is there? Bitter? Well, I just don't wanna see someone go in without hearing the other side of the coin. If I had, I would've saved myself two years of aggravation. You know what did it for me? The Frosting on the cake? Family Reunion.. Yup, That famous yearly get together that they shove down people's throats. First they wanted me to find other agents from other companies and get them to spend the money to go because they use that plus the MREA training as recruitment, then, get this, when you go there, everywhere you go someone's trying to sell you something. I attended the seminar by Dave Jenks, and said to myself, "Why did I fly here to hear this..?"

Telua, you made the right decision, saved yourself A LOT of MONEY (eventually), and I sincerely wish you the very best. I could've just kept quiet, and simply read and gone past, but I felt compelled to speak out and dispel some crap...

As for you, Damon... Take ALL your income, ALL your expenses... Figure out your TRUE percentage. 100% is a myth. NO One ever gets 100%, I know that and so do you. See what the numbers really are.. You don't have to tell us..

It's a Great day !

Thanks

Y'know, I wasn't gonna post again.. but Damon, I'm getting kind of sick of this with you. Please do me a favor and REFRAIN FROM Thinking you know what my motivation are. They sure as hell ain't recruiting, are they? And they can't be revenge, because that's kind of ridiculous. HERE IS MY MOTIVATION... CONCERN! I don't like to see others get the shaft!

GOT IT?

Thanks

"Draw the circles - show the plan!"

I joined Keller Williams a few months ago (beg. of June) and they let me train as much or as little as I want on VARIOUS topics and I have a mentor I meet with one on one, once a week...all sorts of stuff. And I dont even have my license yet.
I dont even pay attention to the profit sharing or recruiting stuff. Yes, they do it, but thats not why I signed up. Commission split, training programs I believe are great. Not interested in profit sharing or recruiting. Thats not my type of focus.

The feeling is mutual, Mr. Shooter...

You're right, I have no idea what your true motivations are, but when you don't list your name on your profile, it makes me wonder...

What do you wonder? Is everything a conspiracy now? I won't do that because you want me to..and I DID tell you what my motivations were, Please READ MY POST OVER, you'll see ...

"HERE IS MY MOTIVATION... CONCERN! I don't like to see others get the shaft!"

Nothing to do with conspiracy, and certainly don't reveal your name for me - it's just good "netiquette."

It's like writing an anonymous op-ed piece in the paper - when the writer chooses not to use his name, it plants a small seed of doubt as to the accuracy of the info, even if true...

Also, if you have a beef with KW, then so be it. The fact is, every large organization has disgruntled employees who've left...including Coldwell Banker. If you got the shaft for something that happened - it sucks, I've had it happen to me at other companies. Was I happy about it? No, of course not.

But to smear KW like you have and to write as if KW has an exclusive hold on shafting employees, then you're in for a rude awakening down the road.

Damon, are you kidding me?

Maybe you just don't like losing an argument, is that it?

"But to smear KW like you have and to write as if KW has an exclusive hold on shafting employees, then you're in for a rude awakening down the road."

In my posts, I only scratched the surface of the problems I saw at Keller Williams. Understand too, I didn't get shafted, I saw where I was, and I in no way wanted to be associated anymore.. I am not going to repeat myself.

I learned today the truth is smear...The thing is, I have only just begun. I'll end it here, don't go in a panic.. I just can't believe the word "Smear"... LOL.. Thank you for your profound statements.. I gave my advice to a poster who was considering KW.. I gave my opinion, and my rendition of my experiences.. The problem is, you don't like it.. Keller Williams is rolled out as "Nirvana".. To the "faithful" any contradictory statements are a complete shock to their system. You see, I went to Family Reunion.. I saw.. Posts like mine might anger you.. I'm sorry.. It wasn't my original intention..

Damon, I swear I am NOT bitter. I just didn't want to see anyone potentially get victimized.... Sorry if that doesn't agree with you or your business model. I just cannot justify ... what does anyone get back for the CAP they keep? No one seems to know the answer to that.. I know they don't do any advertising at all, they throw that back to the agents. Education? Sounds like a very expensive education.. This is what I get from what they keep from my sales..

1. Free Voicemail
2. Free Photocopies
3. Free Faxing
4. Free EMail and Intranet services..
5. Free marketing plans customized for every client. The office prepares it and it's like having an assistant for this..
6. Free updated information, free listing presentation packages, free buyer packages, free so many "downloadables" I can't even begin to cover..
7. Free Advertising in the papers and magazines, Within reason..
8. Free Leadrouter..
9. Free Enhanced Realtor.com for your listings..
10. Free Education.. You don't pay for the office classes and most of the continuing ed class to be able to renew your license...
11. Free phones..
12. Limited admin help.. Free..
13. Free mailings .. Up a a certain point... but it's a good and fair amount (per month).
14. Free input of your listings... At KW, they wanted to offer that on a per charge basis.. At CB, it's free..
and more...

I could go on and on.. but I think I made my point....dollar for dollar..

I despise Censorship and Such.. Don't tell me I smeared anyone.. I'm ending my argument here..You have NO idea how I could go on further..
This isn't even funny anymore..

Sincerely,
Straight Shooter.. (AKA Shoot...)

Damon, I am not personally upset with you, and I am not going to give you another answer to get you upset.. I wish you the best.. Good luck to you, my friend...

Shoot..

Exit Realty has a 70/30 split, no desk fees. If you introduce a new agent to the company you get 10% of their production that comes off the brokers side of the split. AND they offer health insurance through their mortgage side. And good training.

Do you folks at Exit pay for Advertising on your own? Your own Signs? Your phone calls? Your Photocopy paper? Admin help.?

FWIW: I am not with KW, I work with my father who was the #1 agent world-wide for GMAC for the past 2 years. We've been in business for over 20 years and have been with a regional firm, RE/MAX and now currently GMAC by default (GMAC broker bought out RM broker a few years ago). I say all this so that my following statement is taken as objectively as possible - knowing we have experience in what we do.

KW commission split is generally better than comparable CB, C21, etc. It may start at 70/30 plus a 6% franchise fee - but the total dollar amount you pay on an annual basis caps out at anywhere from $18k - $28k (depending upon the broker you are under). You are then responsible for all of your business expenses including business cards, signs, marketing, advertising etc. If you choose to have a desk at KW - you will be charged a desk fee. Should you choose to use your home office or other, you will not be charged a desk fee.

This is currently more than we are paying - but we are unique, we have a 100% split only paying a minimal desk fee (we aren't even located in our brokers building, we have our own building) and minimal franchise fee. It would cost us an additional $6-$8k per year to join KW (should we choose to do so).

With THAT said - we have never utilized the brokers resources (branding) unless required (and it was only required with the smaller company - once we realized it was all about the broker and not the agent, we left rather quickly). We have our own letterhead, envelopes, business cards - our own logo, signs, everything. We are branding ourselves - NOT the broker. Try doing that at CB or C21. That is the key difference between KW and CB/C21 - with KW it's about the agent and their business. With CB/C21 it's about the brokerage.

Next - training. Training is, for the most part, minimal. It is $75 to take the Camp 443 class, and various amounts less than $100 to take various other classes. Additionally, anyone from any brokerage can take any of their classes.

It's one thing to be trained on how to write an offer or sign a listing. It's another thing entirely to be taught how to build a successful business.

KW has a business model for agents that is excellent. All of their training is focused on the model - making it very easy for agents to stay focused and not run around trying every new model. It will not surprise me when KW has more top agents than any other firm within the next 5-10 years.

I do agree that KW agents (most especially newbies with very little sales experience) focus too much on the profit sharing/MLM aspect of the business. Aside from that - KW has better training than any other firm in our market and I recommend it to everyone that asks where they should go if their needs are training and to build their own brand (not a broker brand).

This last post was extremely informative. As a new KW agent I have to agree with most everything. I didn't know non KW agents are allowed to take KW's training, but I wouldn't be surprised. This may not be true in every office--I'm not sure, but if so, can you think of a better recruiting method? KW is very agent focused--we were even allowed to put our non KW website on the business cards that they furnished!
We have an even better deal at our office. Our cap is 16k and then we go 100%. In addition, we do not pay a franchise fee. I assume our broker absorbs that. Also, E&O is only $35 per transaction. So far, we're very pleased. With Prudential and C21 they did much more advertising than KW and we may have received more referrals due to their huge relocation business, but because KW is so agent focused--the only downside is that nothing is handed to you--you must earn it.

I often hear new agents while they are in their decision process of picking the 'right' brokerage. One of the number one comments is: I want floor time or something similar because I want to get leads.

I know they really don't know anything about the business and I find it sad that they pick a company because of that. The leads you'll get from your 'office' wouldn't feed a duck. There aren't enough - and if the office is big enough that there are hundreds coming in a week, how do you think they are disbursed? Think about how many per person that really is.

Then, think about how many leads it takes to actually make a sale. Industry average is 3-10% - that means you have to get a minimum of 10 leads just to potentially make 1 sale (at 10%) and 30 leads to make 1 sale (at 3%). People don't think the whole lead thing through.

There are significantly better ways to get leads - and as long as you are not at a brokerage that keeps you under their thumb all the time (ie, freedom to do your own advertising, have your own website, create your own business cards, BRAND YOURSELF) - you'll be bringing in more leads in a week than the entire company does.

I take floor time 3 times a month and conistantly make about a sale a month, so I think everyone's odds are different. I find I have to speak to 10 people on the average before I sell one, and it takes all of 6 hours a month. It doesn't cost me anything to do this, and of course, I do my other stuff that I do to gain sales.. I can advertise on my own all I want, (what company will say no to that?), but They also do some ads... I have TWO websites, plus I get exposure from them too on the internet with two personal pages (They are free) and ALL my leads are enhanced on Realtor.com)... (That cost me almost $2,000 last year...).. I think it really is up to the individual. I can't see how floor time must be in Idaho, but where I am, it's as good as you make it... Also, I have to say, in terms of branding, the days of Cheesy photos are over. I don't brand at all. I just remind 60 people every two weeks I am in Real Estate..

From your statement above - it sounds like your combined efforts are bringing in 'about a sale a month' - ie, floor time and 60ppl/biweekly.

When you track ROI on each individual lead generation method, you'll find that your time/money is better spent on some than others. Once we came to realize that floor time produced 6 or so sales a year, yet another method we did produced 12+ sales a year (and didn't require sitting in the office) we increased the method that brought a greater return.

Now we are looking at numbers in the hundreds on our various methods and we measure each method's results based on other successful methods.

"From your statement above - it sounds like your combined efforts are bringing in 'about a sale a month' - ie, floor time and 60ppl/biweekly."..

No, PLEASE DON'T "ASSUME"...we know what happens when you... "assume"... LOL..

I do around 30-35 sales a year.. I heard of every "Mike Ferry", "Roger Butcher", "Brian Buffini", "Floyd Wickman".. and more .. Training system out there...I still think floor is a good thing to do. I don't do floor every month, probably 7-8 months a year.. For me, it's fun, I use the time smartly, (even as "leisure" time, and I make my dough off it...

Thanks

I wasn't assuming - I took it directly from your post.

My original point was that in order to get beyond what a typical agent does - you have to treat your business like a business. Businesses that are successful track their ROI on each and every lead. They can tell you exactly how much money and how much time each client costs them.

Too many agents stake their entire business on "floor time" like it's this great big funnel of leads. Thats the wrong thing to do and most of those agents will not be in business a year from now.

Why is it that here in "Idaho" we do more business than most agents anywhere else in the world? Our business isn't even located anywhere near Boise, the largest city in Idaho.

It's because we are focused and we keep our lead generation focused on our business model/plan. That was my point with my original post about KW. The business model/plan for agents is excellent and all of their training is clearly focused on that model. They teach agents how to objectively look at "Craig Proctor, Brian Buffini, Tommy Hopkins, etal" and apply their methods within your focused model/plan. Most people look at these speakers and jump around - trying every conceivable method out there - and then not producing anything tangible.

KW brokerage isn't for everyone - but the agent business model can be.

northidaho, I totally agree with your comments, you seem to know KW very well. I believe what is mainly lureing agents to join KW is the 70/30 split, great business model, and excellent training/lead generation. We are as well the fastest growing company in North America. I work out of the Northville office in Michigan and we are the highest producing KW office in the state of Michigan. My broker used to be at remax for 15 years until he found out about KW. When I interviewed with remax, c21, real estate they all told me 50/50. I was set to sign up with one of those guys so when i left c21 i saw a kw office on my way to my other job and walked in and talked to the broker and when he told me they paid 70/30 i was shocked because every1 else told me 50/50.

Hi. I also just passed my state exam, and came here looking for some assistance with differant views on differant companies. I was saddened to hear two people that apparently have years of experience and knowledge arguing and bickering about the two companies. This looks bad on both companies and is not a very good impression on new comers like myself. Lets be professional.

Have a good day

Hey, it isn't two.. it's more like 7...

Anyways.. I feel strongly about my position. An agent from my area feels "wiped out and burned out" from those 100% concept companies and will join a conventional office this week. The point I was trying to make is don't think 100% means 100% in your pocket.

Christina,

Can you please explain what ROI is, I find that your explanation of leads to be very interesting. As you can see I am a newbie, if you could recomend any books or websites that could give me some insight on the way to handle this I would appreciate it.

ROI is "Return On Investment"...

So, in other words, If I spend 6 Hours a month on "opportunity" time, and I average let's say, 8 sales a year (I average from that activity about 10 to 12... ).. I spend 6 hours a month, plus maybe 10 to 15 hours per client for showings, to sell one house. Is that worth my time...

HELL YA!

ROI is return on investment. Calculating exactly how much something truly costs you.

We use it for every single thing we do. For example, we know exactly how much each 'type' of lead costs us - from a newspaper ad lead, to a sign lead to a web lead. Once we know that, we are able to test various methods and see if we can get the 'cost per lead' as low as possible.

HTH

Christina,
Your floor time comments are totally misleading as floor calls are a good way to pickup clients for new and experienced agents and the cost is right! Free!

If you are just sitting in the office doing nothing except waiting for the phone to ring then that time spent is very unproductive indeed. Most agents that I know are doing other things to occupy their time such as updating their websites, preparing marketing pieces, mailings and the list goes on.

My last full year in Residential I got 7 transactions from my floor calls with 2 of this being double sided. One of those deals was just under a million so I would have to say that the rate of return for my floor time was pretty good as the total floor time was 3 hrs every other week over 8 months for a total of 48hrs.

Floor time is just a single source of leads and the time spent in the office can be used to do that personal branding.

I think that a great deal depends on where you are located. I am finding that branding is essential where I am...if you are not known - you are toast. This may be in good part due to how saturated any given market is with agents.

I can tell you that floor time for me generates about 2-6 calls per MONTH. I had floor time last week and got zero calls. The week before I got one phone call - but the person had an agent already. I have one round of floor duty left for this month. If you are lucky, this MIGHT generate 3 sales/year and the leads are generally small ones. Coops, MAYBE a condo - I have only gotten two leads for people wanting to buy a house who weren't already working with agents. Btw, ours is a very big franchise with over 90 agents - so if anyone should be getting phone calls, its us. So floor time is good for slightly less than $10k a year where I am.

That does not mean that it isn't worth the effort - after all $8-10k is still money. It's also money I made that didn't cost me anything except time - which is very important when you are starting. It added up to roughly $40 an hour - after taking people around, contracts etc.

The only warm leads that I have gotten over the last 3 months have come from my minescule pool of satisfied customers/clients. I've gotten 4 in the past month from that source and one from my SOI. At least the few people who worked with me are happy enough to give me the referals. I had a couple of them write up testimonials - which might be helpful if I ever get any listing presentations -(I'm not holding my breath).

It's an indication of how saturated my market is with agents. Where I am you have to spend a boatload on advertising and and for the most part my ROI is pitiful. I spent roughly $5200 on self-promotion and have gotten not so much as one email or one phone call from it all with the exception of 1 buyer from Craigs list that came to one of my open houses. Ironically, that was free. So for all that money spent - I made $2300.00 from the coop sale from Craigs.

I know people who have fared worse. One person in our office has spent $600 a MONTH for well over a year now on a web site for PPC. His web site is right out in front for most major searches, but it has produced MAYBE one sale. His ROI is worse than mine. After all, by now he has probably spent close to $12k. He apparently has gotten quite a few "leads" but they have not been of high quality. It kept him running around -burning gasoline - but people didn't actually buy. I was planning on spending a great deal for that type of promotion myself - however, from what I am seeing, spending significant sums in any super-saturated situation is going to yield only nominal results.

I'm sticking around primarily part-time now. I am hoping that the market change will cause many agents to leave the field relieving the saturation enough so that when sales pick up, I can be there to capitalize on it. By keeping my name out there and waiting out the carnage I have a shot a reaping good rewards when the time comes. Meantime, I'm trying to find FT work that will pay the bills and allow me to continue self-promotion. I see no other way of handling this.

We call it "floor time" because we're floored if the phone rings.

"Your floor time comments are totally misleading as floor calls are a good way to pickup clients for new and experienced agents and the cost is right! Free!"

If you'll read my post again - I said use floor time as the major reason why you pick an agency is disjointed and not wise.

I seriously doubt that any agent chooses a brokerage solely on the fact that floor time is available to those that want it!

I just did a blog post on this - there are agents that choose based upon 'referrals' from floor calls, walk-ins, etc they may receive from their brokerage.

It's insane, but they do it. I did a survey of people obtaining their license to ask what they were looking for:

Good leads from the broker
A good looking logo
Training (defined by respondees as a broker being available when you write your first contract)
A nice looking building

I am serious - these were the top 4 answers from 65 responses.

Any Keller Williams agents here who have done the Camp 4-4-3?

Is it worth it? What does it entail?

I am not a KW agent - but I took Camp 443, just this past summer, and I've been in the business for over 10 years.

I got quite a few great gems from it and have implemented several things that are tracking ROI very nicely.

I feel it's excellent for new agents.

We have been with KW for 6 years and love it. We actually joined as agents #9 and #10 in California. KW has really grown and is a GREAT company to work with. We have only recruited one agent and our team leaders have never confronted us recruiting pressure. Some of our top agents do recruit many agents to the company and do receive heafty checks, but it has just never been one of our things. What I do like most about them is that you are free to market yourself and not just the company. We are able to put our own phone numbers and names on the signs and have been able to choose our own marketing materials without having to get permission from our Brokers. Marketing ourselves and not just the Company has been successful for us. I have nothing but great things to say about the company and I do encourage you to check them out and if recruiting is not for you, just do not get involved in that. If you like the company enough, you will always speak highly of it regardless of if you are going to get a recruit check or not.

Make it a GREAT Day!!

Why are people knocking Keller Williams? Why are people knocking Coldwell Banker? As long as everyone is happy where they are, what else do you want? This is the only business where you will work with your competition. It's a great business. We're here for networking purposes. Let's do that and make friends instead of foes. Happy selling everyone!!!

I have been a Keller Williams Agent here in Georgia for 3 years. I really enjoy working for Keller Williams. The commission split, new agent training, and the mentor program at my office enticed me to join. Do I like everything about Keller Williams of course not! My advice to new agents take your time and interview with different companies, and find the company you feel best addresses what you are looking for.

A Keller Williams opened up in my city just recently. I think the problem is that at first the newbie agents were running around trying to recruit for profit sharing purposes - and it left everyone with a bad taste in their mouth. Now, people are more positive. I think that sometimes newer agents eager for money have the wrong approach when it comes to profit sharing. The office itself is developing a good reputation after that initial mess up.

LOL..

Now every Keller Williams and Exit Realty "Monkey" is getting wind of this site and forum as a way to recruit people... ...

Birds of a feather, flock together... at least they do it "on the sly" at KW, not blatent... such as at Exit... I honestly don't know which is better... LOL.

Century 21's main website, 21online.com has LIVE on line classes all day every day. Every C21 agent has access to it.

I have worked at KW for 1+ yrs now and it is not what I expected. They teach that Real Estate is a numbers game and that is how they operate the office. They want more and more agents and each agent is really meaningless to them. Because they know that if any of their agents defect and go elsewhere there are others waiting in the wings to take their place. They do have a great training program...but the staff at my office are not really that experienced and sometimes their advice is not that good. They discourage the newer agents from asking any of the other more experienced agents in the office questions...we are supposed to only ask the staff. They are really focused on getting additional agents for their profit sharing. They come across that we are all family but when push comes to shove...it is all about the institution and about the broker and the staff and the few top producers...the rest of us are just there to make them look big. I do not recommend KW. If you are happy where you are read the Red book and stay where you are. KW offices are only as good as the individual broker at each office.

The same is true of EVERY real estate office....the leadership of the office (whether it's an owner, broker, manager, team leader, whatever) will set the tone for the entire office. It holds true whether the office is a big franchise, a regional chain, or a small individually-owned office.

As to the treatment of the top producers in any office: They are the ones making the money, they are the ones that will get more attention and resources. If YOU were closing more than anyone else in your office, would YOU want to be treated exactly the same as a newbie that has never closed a deal? Likely not. This is a tough biz, and that's the way it usually works.

Best of luck to you with your career.

That office is not following the model.

The key is that happy productive agents recruit other happy productive agents.

I've seen KW offices try to recruit their way through abject neglect of newer agents/rising stars and it's not pretty.

It's easy to find what the best KW office in the area is if you enjoy the concepts behind the business model. Look at the production reports via the KW Intranet MORE Reports.

If you can't find a good KW office... find another broker. There are plenty of great opportunities with other franchises.

It's your business.

I cant agree with you more. Coming from 2 different brokerage firms, I realized that a "relatively" new agent should find a firm/ brokerage firm that is focused on agent development. Broker that's concentrated in building his/ her brokerage, and not in competition with the agents also.

For the first part I agree completely. It has a great deal to do with the individual office, broker and office manager. I'm in the middle of taking my leave from an office with a poisonous atmosphere.

As for the second. Everything is RELATIVE. A newbie that has proven themselves and has done fairly well compared to OTHER newbies needs to be given proper attention and help. In my current office this would NEVER EVER HAPPEN....unless you were a top producer within the first 18 months. That is totally unrealistic given the competition in our area.

I am in dire need in knowing how to enter into the world of real estate. I have passed the test and that was an exhilerating feeling. Now it has passed away and I am baffled because I work for the phone company 7:30-4:30 and I really want to sell real estate full time but I know it will take time. Does anyone have any good advice on what approach I should use to really get involved in this business. I am in dire need for some feed back. I am not connected with a broker yet. I am still interviewing to make sure choose the right company. Training is my utmost importance. Thanks so much in advance!!!

Same with KW, but I prefer live training in my office, not some online class. I still place human contact above online training.

The KW office I'll be working out of has at least 1 in office training each day(half of the time there 2 trainings a day).

And I know KW has online training classes/course and videos available too.

Why are you entertaining that post to begin with rwilson99? Clearly the nonsense profile was created just for some idiot to vent "annonymously," because the only post ever made by whomever they are, was in response to this thread about Keller Williams. Coincidence? I think not. Why people hide behind their computers is beyond me. If you have an opinion, defend it just like everyone else on this board does.

I don't prefer either. I can read a book and get something out of it, too. The point was that it's available 24 hours a day. So if I'm sitting around after dinner surfing the web and reading message boards, if I want to I can take a class instead.

And my point was that any national brand offers online training.

The training at my office is still the best, most extensive training in the area and I'm sure KW online training is as good as any other Brokerages.

So, my point still stands, training at my office is still tops in my area.

My advise to any agents enter the market is to never really remain loyal to any one brokerage, however, look at how's offing the best in education and training and go from there.

It really does come down to the office.

Online training is great, but if it's not supported by the culture and the office environment it kinda like kissing your sister.

Most KW offices will let you sit in on office trainings and hang out in the office a little bit as part of the recruitment process.

Who do you meet and see... do you see people hitting the numbers that you want to hit at a similar stage of their business... or do you run into classes that are poorly attended and a major divide between experienced agents and newer up and comers.

The brand name means nothing... find out what the office is like to hang out in... that will tell you everything that you need to know.

I interviewed in Miami for a KW office. I was extremely impressed in their attitudes toward new agents, the training program and the support. Also, KW is for someone who wants upward mobility. You have to think of real estate as your business. This is exactly what I wanted. I don't want to be held back by my broker for everything. At KW in Miami, you are only held back according to the FL RE statutes. KW is very liberal with their advertising, commissions and training. Though the training is a bit much, I need it as a new agent. RE is totally new to me and I feel out of sorts.

Now that being said, after I take my exam this month, and start working at KW, I will return to let you know how accurate my impression of KW was.

That's because YOU pay for everything upfront, that's why...

It really comes down to how you want to run YOUR BUSINESS.

If you control it... you get to pay for it.

Passed my test on the 1st try today. I'm not sweating the small stuff.

I'm scheduled to begin my 4-4-3 training next month and my mls training as well.

Well, then.. You might as well open up your own then, eh?

Does anyone have a site or possible cheat sheet on each company?

I am moving in a couple months and realized that I will NOT be transfering to a branch office.

I'm still considered a new agent (less than a year old) but my commission split is horrible (54/46), my mentor rides me like a donkey about training ever single day which has burned me out and taking floor duty since the receptionist quit (when can I find time to prospect!!!), my clients have to pay over $300 in administrative fees to the brokerage which I find myself having to explain even though other local brokers don't charge admin fees, and I could go on....but I won't bore you.

Anyway, the upside is no desk fees. :rolleyes:

You live and you learn. I just want to make sure I am more informed this time when picking a company as well as observing the office atmosphere.